Author Topic: Your thoughts on OUTING Ebay auctions  (Read 70415 times)

Offline archie leach

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Re: Your thoughts on OUTING Ebay auctions
« Reply #125 on: June 06, 2014, 07:29:12 PM »
It's not a head scratcher to me...the mid-auction analysis is an important umbrella page (and very popular)...if you actually do some research instead of creating false pictures (and saying there is evidence to support that outed auctions went for higher prices when you can never prove it) is a testament to the selfishness of collectors....the popularity of the thread accounts for the 231 pages...

in retrospect I admire the mid auction thread for the analysis of wild pricing by sellers, the authentication of items for sale, the lamenting of rarity over condition, the amount of educated guesses and the overall interest in movie posters....the fear of having an outed auction trumps all that?....I call bullshit...I agree with Rich...this is nothing but a preemptive strike to lock this thread...

Any rational person can see there is no real evidence that an outed auction here commanded a price beyond what "would" have happened...

Show me your proof!!!
Disingenuous arguments are just that...

I purchased a poster on eBay for less than half of what it went for on EMP the next week by a member of this board, who had to outbid at least one other member of this board to get it.  Not posting the auction on here saved me money.  Period. 

To deny the impact of advertising, while living in our current culture, means that you are either a blithering idiot or being deliberately obtuse.

There is absolutely nothing in the mid-auction thread that couldn't have waited to be in the post auction thread except blatant narcissism.

Offline eatbrie

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Re: Your thoughts on OUTING Ebay auctions
« Reply #126 on: June 06, 2014, 07:33:35 PM »
Guys, even though our divergences on the topic are clearly visible, let's try to keep it civil, shall we?  This is a discussion, not a fight.  We are ALL entitled to our opinions, right or wrong.

T
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- I wish to thank all APF members for being part of the World's Largest Social Gathering of Movie Poster Collectors
- "Wishing you the best of luck with All Poster Forum and in encouraging others to appreciate the magical art of film posters" - Martin Scorsese (2009)

Offline archie leach

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Re: Your thoughts on OUTING Ebay auctions
« Reply #127 on: June 06, 2014, 07:35:29 PM »
Not all opinions deserve equal weight...

Offline CSM

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Re: Your thoughts on OUTING Ebay auctions
« Reply #128 on: June 07, 2014, 11:48:42 PM »
OK I will come clean on a great example where this might have applied.  My good poster buddy PM's me about an ebay auction of a poster I was looking for that had a bad title etc. and was started way under price.  I was so worried that someone would find out about it I was a nervous wreck.  I ended up being the only bidder and got it for a mere $325... 

What was the poster?  An Orange Mad Max Australian OS.  Now tell me, with full confidence if that auction had been outed, that I would have been the only bidder.  It would have pissed me off for a good year to have missed out on that poster. 

The guy who told me about it didn't have to.  But he knew I had been looking for it.  He was honorable about it.  That is what this hobby should promote. 

This is what collecting camaraderie should be about.  Whoever tipped you off could have easily purchased it themselves and flipped it instead...
Chris

Offline CSM

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Re: Your thoughts on OUTING Ebay auctions
« Reply #129 on: June 07, 2014, 11:50:27 PM »
How selfish is it to lock a thread based on unsubstantiated fear of competition?

Is that what it is about - "fear"?  Or is it about disrespect and etiquette?
Chris

Offline CSM

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Re: Your thoughts on OUTING Ebay auctions
« Reply #130 on: June 07, 2014, 11:57:02 PM »
blatant narcissism.

Getting these made up for certain forum members:

Chris

Offline Neo

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Re: Your thoughts on OUTING Ebay auctions
« Reply #131 on: June 08, 2014, 12:21:39 AM »
Getting these made up for certain forum members:



It's ironic that the "anti-outing" crowd talk about "camaraderie" yet many are blatantly vitriolic toward fellow collectors who have a different opinion.

Offline MoviePosterBid.com

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Re: Your thoughts on OUTING Ebay auctions
« Reply #132 on: June 08, 2014, 12:36:13 AM »
It's ironic that the "anti-outing" crowd talk about "camaraderie" yet many are blatantly vitriolic toward fellow collectors who have a different opinion.

yep..

Movieposterbid.com is the FIRST All-Movie Poster Auction Site. We're not #1, but we try harder
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Offline CSM

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Re: Your thoughts on OUTING Ebay auctions
« Reply #133 on: June 08, 2014, 12:46:03 AM »
It's ironic that the "anti-outing" crowd talk about "camaraderie" yet many are blatantly vitriolic toward fellow collectors who have a different opinion.

There's quite a disparity between a simple difference of opinion and the actions of those who chose to out auctions they have no intention themselves of bidding on...
Chris

Offline CSM

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Re: Unused concept art
« Reply #134 on: June 08, 2014, 12:49:34 AM »
Mel what was your motivation in posting the auction?

Guess I'll never get an answer now  eyeroll
Chris

Offline Neo

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Re: Your thoughts on OUTING Ebay auctions
« Reply #135 on: June 08, 2014, 01:13:27 AM »
There's quite a disparity between a simple difference of opinion and the actions of those who chose to out auctions they have no intention themselves of bidding on...

Actions that were deemed "OK" by the powers that be, several years ago, yet some people who disagreed with the ruling have been blatantly vitriolic, and have turned their disagreement into this epic saga.

Offline paul waines

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Re: Your thoughts on OUTING Ebay auctions
« Reply #136 on: June 08, 2014, 06:10:30 AM »
Well as part of the Anti-outing crowd, I've never mentioned Camaraderie as such, I've always said collecting posters is a solitary hobby. Yes, a certain bunch of us help each other out, and that is done in private through emails, and phone calls.

It's nice to talk with like minded people on these forums, but what I do with regards to collecting is for my own pleasure. If all these forums ceased to be, it would not affect what and how I collect, and I would still have all my collector friends to share stories with. 
It's more than a Hobby...

Offline archie leach

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Re: Your thoughts on OUTING Ebay auctions
« Reply #137 on: June 08, 2014, 06:28:06 AM »
Actions that were deemed "OK" by the powers that be, several years ago, yet some people who disagreed with the ruling have been blatantly vitriolic, and have turned their disagreement into this epic saga.

Once 'the decision' was made I don't believe I've made any comments against it and I remember reading very few by others, until T started this thread.  

You know, it's actually OK to re-evaluate things from time to time. Really.  It won't kill you.  It's a key step in process improvement...
« Last Edit: June 08, 2014, 06:29:26 AM by archie leach »

Offline Simes

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Re: Your thoughts on OUTING Ebay auctions
« Reply #138 on: June 08, 2014, 11:18:18 AM »
This thread might have run its course.

For my part, I will go with whatever the owners' wishes are - it's their environment, and theirs to do with as they please.

Thanks for having me, happy to stick around etc.

Bruce

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Re: Your thoughts on OUTING Ebay auctions
« Reply #139 on: June 08, 2014, 12:52:55 PM »

Thanks for having me, happy to stick around etc.

What a novel attitude!

Offline erik1925

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Re: Your thoughts on OUTING Ebay auctions
« Reply #140 on: June 08, 2014, 01:00:56 PM »
I think it's better than the "short story" alternative.  ;)


-Jeff

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Re: Your thoughts on OUTING Ebay auctions
« Reply #141 on: June 08, 2014, 03:39:28 PM »
I normally receive PM's about posters that people think I might want and have done the same. I have also shared information privately about posters, dealers, etc. And I DO appreciate those of you who are kind enough to tip me off about an upcoming auction with some good Bogies- odd right?

I was VERY unlucky with outing on this forum once. I secretly named and shamed who did it. I considered it then and still do to be a complete lack of etiquete. That said, lack of etiquete towards each other seems to be the norm here more often than not particularly lately.

For all that it counts, I believe in freedom of information and this forum has done an excellent job in ensuring a good exchange of views and information about the hobby. But ultimately those views should not offend. Perhaps we should think twice before posting, and not just in the middle thread if that were to remain open.

I can see this is a tough call and I wish T&H all the best in taking this forward.

Offline Simes

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Re: Your thoughts on OUTING Ebay auctions
« Reply #142 on: June 09, 2014, 04:21:45 AM »
Not sure the thread needed to be pinned.

Hopefully the need to revisit the thread will go away, unlike Latest Acquisition, for example.

Offline Harry Caul

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Re: Your thoughts on OUTING Ebay auctions
« Reply #143 on: June 09, 2014, 09:22:09 AM »
Not sure the thread needed to be pinned.

Hopefully the need to revisit the thread will go away, unlike Latest Acquisition, for example.

I disagree.  I think pinning it is the correct move, specifically so we don't have to have this discussion again.  It is clearly a contentious issue around here and if the discussion gets buried it will surely surface again soon. 

boxofficebrian

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Re: Your thoughts on OUTING Ebay auctions
« Reply #144 on: June 09, 2014, 10:02:41 AM »
I know that I’m a total ‘newb’ to this hobby and to the boards, but since this is the internet and everyone gets a voice… I’m going to chime in.

<Please understand that I’m trying to state my opinion on this matter and though it will not be in line with many of you, it’s just that, MY OPINION… I’m not intending to insult, berate or anger anyone…but I’d like to at least share MY OPINION. Hopefully, as the new guy you don't just skip over my .02>

First, I think it’s important that I explain that I have a number of hobbies and am pretty involved in each.

My primary interest is a collectible card game: Magic the Gathering. For years, I dealt in the original paintings done for the game.

Initially, there was very little involvement in this aspect of the hobby and I would often purchase original pieces of artwork from the artists in the range of $100-300 each. All was good. I had a small group of fellow collectors and we aided one another in searching out our wants.

As with most hobbies, word caught on and new individuals wanted to enter into ‘our’ market. We did our best to be accommodating and help them get started. Popularity grew and the paintings went from a few hundred to a few thousand. Also, it became an all out, every man for themselves market.

Initially, I was very turned off by this. Collectors that I helped teach the hobby were ‘outing’ pieces and costing me money- but more importantly pieces I wanted!

I wrestled with this for some time and then realized something… this is a hobby involving rare items (in that instance one of one paintings.) Whether I like it or not, the reality is deepest pockets win. I could want an original Hidlebrandt more than anyone else- but if the guys next to me can pay more, he wins. Period.

Ok… so do I get upset with the collectors ‘outing’ the available pieces? I could… but I feel that would be very selfish of me. I’d think it naïve to believe there aren’t other people in my hobby that would want the same things as me…and frankly they deserve the same right as me…if it’s available I want to know and they should too.

(Mind you, I was a dealer… so the casual collectors not only cut into my ability to collect, but to make money. -  The game had to change and it took me awhile to come to grip with that.)

A few years ago I tried to get involved with coin collecting. I was new to the hobby and I stopped at a small coin shop. The gentleman there was extremely rude. He acted like the comic book guy from the Simpsons... I was a nuisance and not worth his time. In fact, I tried to join a number of forums as well and that was a general vibe I got from folks. Also, everyone was trying to help the fellow dealers on the site and the rest be damned. I said to hell with it and never bought another coin.

With posters, I didn’t know what to expect. Some folks here were great! I received many PMs from folks introducing themselves and making me feel welcome… what a wonderful feeling and one that makes me want to be a part of this hobby.

Then I see threads like this…

I understand both sides, but it comes across in my eyes as the big dogs upset because they are missing out on their wants and/or their ability to make more money…but in doing so, you are ostracizing the little guys that help make a hobby what it is…

What’s worse are the little ‘digs’ I keep seeing toward Mel…I only hope that they are in jest or stem from very strong friendships with him that I don’t know about… Frankly, Mel acted as an ambassador to me. Without his enthusiasm and welcoming nature I don’t know if I’d still be interested in this hobby. You need people like that or what good is the hobby in the long run?

Just remember the next time a poster you want gets ‘outed’, there’s someone on the other end of that auction that’s just excited about the piece as you… and in a hobby dealing with rarity deepest pockets win and every collector deserves a shot.

Offline Simes

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Re: Your thoughts on OUTING Ebay auctions
« Reply #145 on: June 09, 2014, 10:06:01 AM »
I disagree.  I think pinning it is the correct move, specifically so we don't have to have this discussion again.  It is clearly a contentious issue around here and if the discussion gets buried it will surely surface again soon. 

Fair point.  Yes.

Offline Crazy Vick

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Re: Your thoughts on OUTING Ebay auctions
« Reply #146 on: June 09, 2014, 10:30:12 AM »
I voted to lock it. Same way a jury gets sequestered, don't corrupt the results. Aren't insider deals the reason the economy has gone to sh-t anyway? 

If you see something, tell me later, when the auction's over - or email/PM me if you think its something i missed and might be interested in.  That's really what your intentions should be about. TELLING EVERYBODY, on the other hand, is more about personal ego (look how great I am, and look what I found)

My opinion, also as a new member.  Just want to reiterate that I really appreciate APF and all you good people (CSM, Erik, Bruce etc) who comment on my posts   bed1 :) :)

Online skyjackers

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Re: Your thoughts on OUTING Ebay auctions
« Reply #147 on: June 09, 2014, 10:35:21 AM »
Without his enthusiasm and welcoming nature I don’t know if I’d still be interested in this hobby.

This is in no way meant to be rude, but I don't understand why you need someone else's enthusiasm to fuel this hobby. Doesn't the passion come from within?

boxofficebrian

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Re: Your thoughts on OUTING Ebay auctions
« Reply #148 on: June 09, 2014, 10:39:12 AM »
This is in no way meant to be rude, but I don't understand why you need someone else's enthusiasm to fuel this hobby. Doesn't the passion come from within?

I feel a large part of any hobby is sharing it with like minded individuals.

If that weren't the case then there would be no "share your latest acquistion thread" Monthly pick up threads... or really forums like this at all.

Online skyjackers

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Re: Your thoughts on OUTING Ebay auctions
« Reply #149 on: June 09, 2014, 11:00:05 AM »
Maybe not. I guess I collected posters long before the internet and forums so never felt the need, or had the platform to share. 'Latest acquisitions' is my favourite thread though so maybe you have a good point :)