Author Topic: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....  (Read 2203860 times)

Offline MoviePosterBid.com

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #2775 on: May 30, 2012, 08:19:32 PM »
Mel.. you know that you're my pal, but the problem you have in this concerning this particular poster and concerning how you arrive at some of your suppositions is , as we used to say, "all wet"

people like Myself, Sean, Bruce etc who have been selling comics, posters and the like for many decades (in my case, selling since 1966) are able to arrive at much more educated guesses than you can because of our experience. While 10 copies may have been sold publicly in X period, you have few records for what has sold on ebay since 1997 and you have no knowledge of dealer private sales. I may or may not know some of this information which helsp me arrive at a number. Also, I have experience with collectors that shows me what the recycle rate is. I have posters I've had for 45 years and my collection doesn't open to the public unless I decide to get rid of that item. I also know people who sell the week after it arrives in the mail.

I have direct knowledge of things that help me arrive at a number. I can't see how there couldn't be more than 100 Barbarella B and I wouldn't be surprised if there are many many more than that. It just doesn't resell as often as other posters, because collectors are more likely to hold a rare poster
« Last Edit: May 30, 2012, 08:24:50 PM by MoviePosterBid.com »

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Offline oldposterho

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #2776 on: May 30, 2012, 08:21:06 PM »
You do have to throw the age of the poster you're talking about into the equation as well.  I think a rough estimate would be for every decade you go back, take a zero off of the number of available posters.  There's a decades difference betwixt "FP" and "TGFH", that's going to have a big difference in the surviving quantity.

Also with "modern" (post-'60s) (I know, I know) posters, there's always the threat of some big NSS stash lurking behind the scenes, just waiting to be unloaded.  I'd guess for a poster as late as "Barbarella," even for a rare style, you're still talking about a potential of low hundreds in the mix.
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Offline CineMasterpieces

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #2777 on: May 30, 2012, 08:41:57 PM »

Speaking of "stashes", check out what someone in the Netherlands just sent us. 5 NM-M unused British Godfather one sheets.



Offline CineMasterpieces

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #2778 on: May 30, 2012, 08:44:08 PM »

Charlie.

I don't remember exactly what we sold the rolled Barbarella style B for. We had it listed for 3k. We may have sold it for full price. If not it was most likely discounted no more than 10%.

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #2779 on: May 30, 2012, 08:54:26 PM »
Also with "modern" (post-'60s) (I know, I know) posters, there's always the threat of some big NSS stash lurking behind the scenes, just waiting to be unloaded.  I'd guess for a poster as late as "Barbarella," even for a rare style, you're still talking about a potential of low hundreds in the mix.

Yeah, the Mysterians poster is a prime example.  Heritage has unloaded several hundred of them in the last couple of years on Ebay and you could get one for $10.  A few years ago they were selling for much more, like this one:


Offline Ari

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #2780 on: May 30, 2012, 10:23:39 PM »
so can we at least agree there is 27?
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Offline Zorba

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #2781 on: May 30, 2012, 10:32:23 PM »
so can we at least agree there is 27?

No. I am still checking with my contacts.

Offline eatbrie

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #2782 on: May 30, 2012, 10:49:11 PM »
...few collectors are lifers and most keep a poster only for a few years before reselling...

The amount of life collectors who actually participate in online conversations is also minimal.  I can think of at least 10 huge collectors who will not join a forum or display their collections.  And that's only the people I know.  There are many, many more.  And a lot of them, I'm sure, own your Barbarella poster.  For all we know, there could be more than 500 out there.

Look at Stout's The Thing.  About 300 were printed.  And they ALL still exist.  How many show up for sale every year?

I'm only using the above example because at least we know how many were printed.  If we could estimate how many Barbarella were printed in 1968, which I think is the key question, we could have a better idea how many are still out there.

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Offline Ari

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #2783 on: May 30, 2012, 10:57:27 PM »
yep .
One of my best buddies has one, and he has never heard of APF - he has only heard of NS4 because he is my friend & we chat.(in person).

can we say 28 and rising?
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Offline crowzilla

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #2784 on: May 31, 2012, 01:43:27 AM »
Take the example of "This Gun For Hire" one sheet. We know there have been 10 sales in the last 10 years from Heritage (7), Emovie (1), and Christie's (2).
By contrast, there have been 60 sales of "Forbidden Planet."  Can we assume that there are roughly six times more extant FP posters?

There are probably 20-30-40x more Forbidden Planet one-sheets than This Gun For Hire.
In 1993, my partner went to a friend's house in Miami after he had returned from Cuba and among the loads of goodies he had, he laid out 17 never-used snow-white papered copies of Forbidden Planet.
I had only been part-time selling for a few years (we owned two comic-book stores at the time and that was our main thing) and was afraid this was going to crash the market on the title, so I mistakenly only bought five copies. The other 12 he sold in one lot to a very prominent NY dealer.
Later on when I was telling (more like warning) some of the other then-long time dealers about my purchase and what I had scene the response was more along the lines of "That's it?", with a prominent local dealer (Paper Chase) telling me about an exchange they had purchased a few years prior where they had ended up with over 40 copies of Forbidden Planet (all in various stages of use/non-use) and that was after the exchange had been selling off posters to collectors for over a decade.

I have found that there are generally five levels of rarity in posters

5. Post Star Wars.
   That one movie really turned the hobby around. Dealers were buying rolls and rolls of this poster for years (literally) and it ramped up demand for all paper in general

4. 1960 - 1976.
   It was around this time that some organized collecting started in earnest, some exchanges started selling material directly to collectors, and some dealers started speculating in "new" releases (James Bond, etc). I have a Film World catalog from 1967 that lists most James Bond and 50s sci-fi posters at $1-2 each already, and actually has some early Universal horror lobby sets priced at $75-100 per set (including Dracula). The most expensive item in the catalog is an original German set on Die Nibelungen for $250. So even back then the rarity of certain pieces was already established. (and Bruce if you are reading this, I loaned this to you and would like to get it back some day).

3. 1945 - 1959. 
    Post-war and most things can be found with a little effort, as the NSS basically stored everything until they couldn't use it anymore.

2. Post NSS, Wartime (1940-1945)
    Wartime paper drives pulped tons of material made during this time (and earlier), but NSS kept enough stuff around to ensure they could supply posters to theaters

1. Pre-NSS, Pre-War (and then add pre-code for some more toughness).
    For each studio, the dates will vary as to when they signed their contracts with NSS and the paper becomes more plentiful, but as a general rule pre-NSS material from each studio is drastically more difficult to find than post-NSS.

Of course there will always be exceptions to the above rules (Stashes of individual titles found somewhere, or particular titles pulped prematurely, etc.), but this gives a general guideline to how I see the rarity of most paper. Perhaps Bruce, Rich, or other longtime dealers can give their own thoughts.

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Offline MoviePosterBid.com

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #2785 on: May 31, 2012, 03:26:17 AM »
in 1968 at the New York ComicCon, there was a guy just to the right of the entrance that was selling movie paper (I don't know who it was). He had Buster Crabbe at his table signing Flash Gordon cards for customers (after they bought the cards of course). On his small cardboard display he had Frankenstein lobby cards at $100 each  (quite a sum for a truly poor 11 year old, who, though he was already selling comics, never had enough food. Truly.)

I did buy a DTESS pressbook for $5 and a Beast From 20,000 Fathoms 1sh for $15. I did sell both for a profit within an hour or so. I think Ron Borst bought the latter from me while Mark Carducci bought the former (sorry you're gone Mark).

When Jerry Ohlinger had the two Phantom one sheets in his small store, they were $1000 each. Maybe that was '71 or '72. Maybe earlier. When I saw them I was literally awestruck, even at that age.

I forget what my point was supposed to be, so let's just make it a history lesson
 ;D

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Offline Tang Lung in Rome

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #2786 on: May 31, 2012, 05:56:10 PM »
Today I decided to flip thru Photoplay OZ , Feb '67......one of the readers thought it was a shame that you could not buy movie posters ;)

Batman article , The Saint , 007 YOLT.......holy nostalgia.

I think extras on Batman who had small speaking parts got like 150$ , that was a lot of dough then !
« Last Edit: May 31, 2012, 05:58:02 PM by Tang Lung in Rome »

Offline Tang Lung in Rome

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #2787 on: May 31, 2012, 06:01:02 PM »
US posters aren't really that rare , try to find danish posters (TX Chainsaw , 007 1st issue matte paper).....now that's rare  bed1

Offline Ari

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #2788 on: June 01, 2012, 06:41:43 AM »
in the guise of being fair, with the intention of both showing off and laughing.

I am at this moment the highest bidder on each and every one of Rich's auctions.
Suck on that ya muthas... ;D

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Offline MoviePosterBid.com

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #2789 on: June 01, 2012, 03:16:47 PM »
in the guise of being fair, with the intention of both showing off and laughing.

I am at this moment the highest bidder on each and every one of Rich's auctions.
Suck on that ya muthas... ;D

woo-hoo.. and I now just realized that 5 auctions of inserts are missing..
have to see what's with that when I get to the office (yeah folks.. I work late.. I get in at 1 or 2pm.. suck on that!!)

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Offline stewart boyle

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #2790 on: June 01, 2012, 03:19:56 PM »
woo-hoo.. and I now just realized that 5 auctions of inserts are missing..
have to see what's with that when I get to the office (yeah folks.. I work late.. I get in at 1 or 2pm.. suck on that!!)
Sometimes I roll up out of bed at 9...life`s good.. :P.

Stew
« Last Edit: June 01, 2012, 03:20:45 PM by stewart boyle »

Offline erik1925

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #2791 on: June 01, 2012, 03:32:26 PM »
There are probably 20-30-40x more Forbidden Planet one-sheets than This Gun For Hire.
In 1993, my partner went to a friend's house in Miami after he had returned from Cuba and among the loads of goodies he had, he laid out 17 never-used snow-white papered copies of Forbidden Planet.
I had only been part-time selling for a few years (we owned two comic-book stores at the time and that was our main thing) and was afraid this was going to crash the market on the title, so I mistakenly only bought five copies. The other 12 he sold in one lot to a very prominent NY dealer.
Later on when I was telling (more like warning) some of the other then-long time dealers about my purchase and what I had scene the response was more along the lines of "That's it?", with a prominent local dealer (Paper Chase) telling me about an exchange they had purchased a few years prior where they had ended up with over 40 copies of Forbidden Planet (all in various stages of use/non-use) and that was after the exchange had been selling off posters to collectors for over a decade.

I have found that there are generally five levels of rarity in posters

5. Post Star Wars.
   That one movie really turned the hobby around. Dealers were buying rolls and rolls of this poster for years (literally) and it ramped up demand for all paper in general

4. 1960 - 1976.
   It was around this time that some organized collecting started in earnest, some exchanges started selling material directly to collectors, and some dealers started speculating in "new" releases (James Bond, etc). I have a Film World catalog from 1967 that lists most James Bond and 50s sci-fi posters at $1-2 each already, and actually has some early Universal horror lobby sets priced at $75-100 per set (including Dracula). The most expensive item in the catalog is an original German set on Die Nibelungen for $250. So even back then the rarity of certain pieces was already established. (and Bruce if you are reading this, I loaned this to you and would like to get it back some day).

3. 1945 - 1959. 
    Post-war and most things can be found with a little effort, as the NSS basically stored everything until they couldn't use it anymore.

2. Post NSS, Wartime (1940-1945)
    Wartime paper drives pulped tons of material made during this time (and earlier), but NSS kept enough stuff around to ensure they could supply posters to theaters

1. Pre-NSS, Pre-War (and then add pre-code for some more toughness).
    For each studio, the dates will vary as to when they signed their contracts with NSS and the paper becomes more plentiful, but as a general rule pre-NSS material from each studio is drastically more difficult to find than post-NSS.

Of course there will always be exceptions to the above rules (Stashes of individual titles found somewhere, or particular titles pulped prematurely, etc.), but this gives a general guideline to how I see the rarity of most paper. Perhaps Bruce, Rich, or other longtime dealers can give their own thoughts.



Great synopsis and break down, Sean. Very informative. Thanks for that.  thumbup




-Jeff

Offline Ari

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #2792 on: June 01, 2012, 09:51:09 PM »
woo-hoo.. and I now just realized that 5 auctions of inserts are missing..
have to see what's with that when I get to the office (yeah folks.. I work late.. I get in at 1 or 2pm.. suck on that!!)

Oh nice, I need some more inserts.
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Offline MoviePosterBid.com

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #2793 on: June 01, 2012, 10:22:39 PM »
Oh nice, I need some more inserts.

go get 'em

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Offline Ari

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #2794 on: June 01, 2012, 11:05:25 PM »
yes mr Boss man.
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Offline 110x75

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #2795 on: June 01, 2012, 11:44:23 PM »

I am at this moment the highest bidder on each and every one of Rich's auctions.
Suck on that ya muthas... ;D


I can see a few I like. I might get one or two from you if you win  ;)
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Offline Ari

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #2796 on: June 01, 2012, 11:52:42 PM »
ahhha.
maybe Ill consign them all to Rich  ;D
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Posterodyssey

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #2797 on: June 03, 2012, 04:30:34 AM »
OneSheetIndex's Barbarella Style B is up:



Wow! 1,000,didn't know this was in such demand now.Might be scarce on ebay now,but 10 years ago they popped up more than twice a year.Not sure if it's that rare really.They all got bought up during the initial ebay craze and everyone is sittin' on them would be my guess.
Myself,I'm partial to the 40x60 art,or the Japanese stuff.
 

Offline Ari

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #2798 on: June 03, 2012, 04:34:22 AM »
yeah would have been 10-12 years ago my friend got one, I remember comparing it one night with his other versions of the films posters, and we thought it was the ugliest, but he loves the film.
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Posterodyssey

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #2799 on: June 03, 2012, 04:50:24 AM »
Yeah I agree,Ari,doesn't compare to the other styles.But if ya love the film I can certainly understand wanting this poster.
I did enjoy all her different costumes but,film not my favorite. ;)

Anthony