Post-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....

[crowzilla]

This rolled Detour insert sold for $1,325.00 on Ebay... nowhere in the listing mentions it being original or reprint or whatever the case may be. Am I mistaken, that this is an 1980s reproduction and not an original insert from the 40s??

It is listed under originals, and the description says original - but yes, impossible to tell from the single poor photo posted.
Probably another soon to be user of the ebay money back guarantee.

I will also note that the seller of the Frankenstein lobby set Starling pointed out also sold a Son of Frankenstein "original" set for $150 and just yesterday had a Ghost of Frankenstein set sell for almost $3,000.

Lots of buyer bewares out there

[crowzilla]

Friday the 13th was my ultimate favorite back then, then Halloween, then Freddy. 

I think you could argue Halloween is like Phantom of the Opera, Friday the 13th is Dracula, and Freddy is Frankenstein.

[porkinsred6]

These don't appear very often, and I haven't diligently followed the prices, but 2 years ago, I saw one of these at a fairly well known place go for $5,000 and I was a little surprised.  Another one not long after sold for $7,000.  I chatted briefly with a Star Wars expert and he said these are not extremely rare, and he remembers when there was a time that a few sold for about $500.  Very impressive upwards trend in the Star Wars market.

It is not known how many of these are floating around and more keep appearing!  I don't trust them.  would be interesting too look at one under a loupe...

Star Wars rare is even more subjective than other poster genres.  Most star wars collectors collect things like toys where there are millions made.  Even the rarest production toy has hundreds of known examples.  Even the coveted Rocket Firing Boba fett which sells for hundreds of thousands of dollars and is considered a grail among toy collectors has over 70 known examples across the different variants.  But when there are so many toy collectors out there, demand far outstrips supply.

I'm a huge star wars collector and had to move to pre-production items to make it fun to hunt.

[Neo]

I remember buying my copy for about 25p many years ago. The seller had a stack of at least 10 so I wish I'd purchased more. I did consider it at the time but being a buyer rather than a seller I didn't think there was much point.

Maybe there are quite a few in collections.  Seems like they don't appear for sale very often.  If WorthPoint wasn't so expensive, I'd have a subscription there; it would be helpful to see how many have sold at eBay, as most folks with video store stuff seem to not know about, or don't consign their stuff at places like eMoviePoster, etc.

That Elm Street result is very impressive but I wonder how repeatable it would be?

Yeah, and as HM said, it was for sale at that price for at least a year and a half, but maybe more examples will start to sell more often near that price.

[Neo]

It is not known how many of these are floating around and more keep appearing!  I don't trust them.  would be interesting too look at one under a loupe...

That is an interesting perspective.  Are you suggesting these may have been made fairly recently, with newer processes and/or different folks printing them, than the known original posters from when The Empire Strikes Back was released?  I think it's safe to say the well known Star Wars experts would have seen that.

But when there are so many toy collectors out there, demand far outstrips supply.

Yeah Star Wars seems to have one of the most extensive fan bases.

[eatbrie]

I own one and the paper is absolutely identical to early 80s paper, so are any aging marks.  It is not a recent printing.

T

[Neo]

I own one and the paper is absolutely identical to early 80s paper, so are any aging marks.  It is not a recent printing.

T

 

When P said "more keep appearing" I thought he may be implying that there are possibly more still being printed.  Also, with the above example, and everything else original, buying from a place like eMoviePoster is peace of mind for folks who aren't such seasoned collectors.

[Neo]

Pretty good result for a great poster (and movie) IMO.  The artwork is more of a fun/silly horror style, but they kinda spooked me when I was a kid haha.






This bidding history is a little interesting - only 2 bidders.  Just goes to show how much higher a price can go when there's more than 1 person, or house bidder who is bidding.  (For the record I'm not saying I think there was a house bidder here.)

[eatbrie]

When P said "more keep appearing" I thought he may be implying that there are possibly more still being printed.  Also, with the above example, and everything else original, buying from a place like eMoviePoster is peace of mind for folks who aren't such seasoned collectors.

I don’t think more keep appearing.  It looks like a roll of 50, maybe 100, was found in Japan and sold little by little.  Most of them are in the end of collectors and will not be sold.  Like mine.  Another portion is making the rounds, being sold and resold…. Impossible to track.  I have owned 2.  I gave one away years ago and kept the other.  One had aging spots which I have seen on 80s material before.  Everything was spot on, paper, smell, ink, aging…. No doubt they were printed a long time ago, prob for an aborted international distribution campaign. Why they ended up in Japan, who knows.  That’s irrelevant imo.

T

[Neo]

I don’t think more keep appearing.

Yeah, some skepticism is good, but in this case, most of the leading experts (you included) seem to agree.

With such high sales results, it seems like if there were very many they would appear more often, as the price is certainly trending upwards rapidly.  There's no way to know the exact number, unless there was only one source who could confirm that they received the only ones printed.

[eatbrie]

I want to say 50 or less.  Round number.  But then again, I know that Saul Bass had 300 copies of his Schindler's List printed (for his own use after Universal refused the art), and very few ever pop up at auction.  Keep in mind a lot of posters are destroyed, even with small numbers.  Some go to execs who couldn't care less about them and toss them, others get lost, damaged in transit, etc.  So it's just impossible to number.  But 50 to 100 seems legit to me.  It's a nothing number considering the millions of Star Wars fans around the world.

T

[porkinsred6]

If you ever have a chance to look at it with a loupe T, I would love to hear what you see.  When these first appeared in what... 2009 ? there were only 2 or 3 and they have been slowly dripped out and it seems like more and more keep appearing coming out of Asia.  I guess it's possible that someone in Japan has a roll of 50+ and has been dripping them out over 15 years but that still doesn't explain where they came from between 1980 and 2009.  It seems strange to me that the rejected art version made it all the way to the 1 sheet size all completed and no one knew about it for 30 years.  And why Japan?  why not some random print facility worker's attic in America where most of the other preproduction posters have been discovered? why 1 sheet size?  Japan doesn't have 1 sheets and these aren't B1s...

The hairy bootlegs also look different under a loupe compared to the theatrical posters and they have been around since the 80s too.

[eatbrie]

Believe what you will, it's all fine.  My experience tells me that it's the real deal, and it's enough for me personally.  Everybody is entitled to his/her opinion.  Unfortunately, I have never been in the business of examining posters with a loupe, I only follow my instincts, so there is nothing I can prove one way or another.  I spent $1,500 on mine, I am not an expert in posters, I don't even know what that means, but I've been collecting for some time and I know enough to be happy with this poster.

Sorry I couldn't be more specific, it's not my thing.

T

[porkinsred6]

Speaking of Star Wars posters, anyone get anything at last night's Heritage auction?  I thought there were several bargains but somethings went for a lot more than they should have.

[eatbrie]

Ha, I just noticed it.  Didn't know about it.  Thankfully, I have pretty much everything, a couple of items I would have bid on, though.  Oh well...

T

[Neo]

I am not an expert in posters

Sorry I didn't mean to label you as an expert if that's not what you want to be called.  Considering you have hundreds of Star Wars posters, and you've been buying, researching, seeing them in person, etc. for years, you have much more knowledge on the subject than most folks.

[porkinsred6]

it's like the Dunning Kruger graph.  The more you know, the more you know you aren't an expert.  People for some reason think of me a Star Wars poster expert and I'm learning new things all the time!

I won the concept mock up to go with the other one I won a few months ago.  I wonder if they are slowly dripping out the whole set...

[Neo]

I won the concept mock up to go with the other one I won a few months ago.  I wonder if they are slowly dripping out the whole set...

If you don't mind me asking, which concept piece did you win, and which set is this?

[porkinsred6]

sorry I forget not everyone here knows I collect star wars almost exclusively.  It was the poster concept mock up on board with the rejected (because it's terrible) tag line "An age old story in a strange new place".  At least I think this is mounted to a board with pasted on elements?  The description doesn't say but the image looks it, and  at a previous auction I won a different one that was on a board with pasted on elements that looks nearly identical but with another tag line. I'm not sure how many of these still exist, but Charley Lippincott's widow consigned his paper samples of these rejected posters to propstore a while a go and there were 17 different ones.  But I doubt the original mockups that were photographed all still exist.  I spoke to another knowledgeable collector who remembers at least some of these mockups sold as a lot once upon a time and it was fewer 10.

[eatbrie]

There is a Star Wars thread, btw, under Genre.  You should post your best pieces.  I also collect some Star Wars, but no mockups or those posters wuth color bars on the side.

T

[porkinsred6]

I have posted in there sometimes.  I'm more here for the conversation.  I don't try to get every production poster like you, just US stuff and I do get those posters with the color bars.  I have about 10 different ones now including some 1 of 1s.  But I've seen some people here don't like them for whatever reason.

-Danny

[Neo]

Very cool.  Now I see what you mean by "concept mock up" - a piece that was made before a poster was made.  In any case, the concept pieces and posters are interesting, especially for a blockbuster like Star Wars. 

[eatbrie]

The fun about this little hobby is that we are all different and we all collect different things.  I don’t know if you’ve ever seen my website, but I ONLY collect theatrical posters, but from around the world.  I don’t collect the color bar posters, because they are not theatrical posters to me.  They are attempts at getting it right.  Same with mockups.  I worked at studios here in Hollywood for many years and I saw tons of mockups.  They all ended in the trash, because they were refused for not being what the studios wanted.  These are my limitations and I stick to them because it’s already hard to collect what I collect.

T

[porkinsred6]

yes, I've admired your collection for a long time T.  Always a pleasure to browse your site! 

[eatbrie]

Sorry I didn't mean to label you as an expert if that's not what you want to be called.  Considering you have hundreds of Star Wars posters, and you've been buying, researching, seeing them in person, etc. for years, you have much more knowledge on the subject than most folks.

It's not what you said, worry not.  I just feels that social media has turned everyone into experts.  Everybody has something to say about everything.  It's ridiculous.  And I seriously do not understand what being a poster expert means.  We're talking about printed paper, right?  There are no experts, only people with opinions.  And you know what people say about opinions, they're like assholes, everybody's got one and everyone thinks everyone else's stinks.

T