Author Topic: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....  (Read 2212811 times)

Offline ATLfun

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #1425 on: October 16, 2011, 04:46:30 PM »
  Making this thread members only seems like a great idea.  There is always two to three times more guests logged in than members.  Why should they be rewarded with great detective work?  What do you think Holiday?


  Brian



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« Last Edit: October 16, 2011, 05:50:34 PM by ATLfun »
   "Please step away from the keyboard.  In my unsolicited opinion, you paid too much for your poster," said APF Price Police Officer Thierry.  




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Offline CSM

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #1426 on: October 16, 2011, 04:52:02 PM »
Personally, making this thread "members only" changes very little.  There is no discussion between members and non-members.  These are issues between existing members and so making the thread "members only" serves little purpose.  
« Last Edit: October 16, 2011, 04:52:17 PM by CSM »
Chris

Offline MoviePosterBid.com

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #1427 on: October 16, 2011, 04:56:25 PM »
* I also understand they're going to adopt his rules in Muskogee Oklahoma and Skobee Montana

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #1429 on: October 16, 2011, 05:29:04 PM »
 Making this thread members only seems like a great idea.  There is always two to three times more guests logged in than members.  Why should they be rewarded with great detective work?  What do you think Holiday?

Brian.. I actually think such a thing is wrong-headed.

the #1 fact of this forum is that it was created as a vehicle to share information
some information shared leaves some people disappointed
less information shared is a dis-service to the world poster collecting community

is it all about "me" or is it about "us (meaning everyone known or unknown)"

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Charlie

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #1430 on: October 16, 2011, 05:41:41 PM »
So I'll now pose this to you Charlie... because of your preconceived notions about "Bond collectors", you believe it is ok to 'out' those auctions but not others?  Like Mel you are trying to qualify the hypocrisy in your position with statements and language like the following:


I don't have any preconceived notions about "bond collectors".  Are you sure you got the right post?  Are we having a rational discussion?  You may have skewed my post to a defensive posture regarding Mel's post.  Mel can take care of himself.  It could be any poster not just "Bond" posters; but I am starting to form notions about "Bond Collectors".  Sheesh!  I even discussed the Mad Max.  Read the whole post slowly, perhaps twice. I even mentioned a Kwai poster.  mesmrized

I have no chips in the game; I was just attempting to provide a rational analysis.

Quote
Regardless of what we think will happen, at the end of the day no one really knows. It is disingenuous for you or Mel to state as fact that you do know, and then try to use that to back up your inconsistent rules.  Treat everyone fairly is all I ask.  Either out all auctions, even for stuff you are bidding on... or wait until they are over discuss.  Otherwise you are a hypocrite an no amount of qualifications will change that.

Yep that is what I said, no one really knows.  It obvious to you that we would be hypocrites, how did you arrive at that? I have never outed an auction in this thread. You do know how much work it would be to out all the auctions I come across.  Thousands a week; be realistic here.  But if you really think about it, the general trend takes you to Mel's conclusion regarding the expected ending price of the poster.  My point was that if you didn't already know about it then you have a weak game anyway.  I haven't been in this dog fight and haven't presented any rules other than the few courtesies for thought. Again, I don't know who you think your responding to, but like I said I haven't actually outed any auctions in this thread other than the one I mentioned that should be in this thread (I searched to confirm this).  I have no dog in this fight; I am just commenting.   In fact I stated I could easily see both sides of the argument.  And didn't really pick one in absolute terms; more a discussion of both sides the suckiness of what Mel did but perhaps why he did it and shouldn't be hung for it...

Offline ATLfun

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #1431 on: October 16, 2011, 05:45:46 PM »
Brian.. I actually think such a thing is wrong-headed.

the #1 fact of this forum is that it was created as a vehicle to share information
some information shared leaves some people disappointed
less information shared is a dis-service to the world poster collecting community

is it all about "me" or is it about "us (meaning everyone known or unknown)"


  Easy tiger......I was only referring to this mid-auction thread.  The rest of the forum would be open.  Why should guests be able to view this thread to check on potential bargains without contributing to the group at large.  There is not a single shred of this "vital information" that could not be disclosed in a post auction thread.

  Brian


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« Last Edit: October 16, 2011, 06:12:33 PM by ATLfun »
   "Please step away from the keyboard.  In my unsolicited opinion, you paid too much for your poster," said APF Price Police Officer Thierry.  




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Charlie

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #1432 on: October 16, 2011, 06:14:48 PM »
Charlie, the issue is NOT that people thought they were going to get the Bond poster or any other poster for peanuts - most of the collectors that frequent here are much more realistic and experienced than that - it really all comes down to a disagreement (basically) on the motivation of an "outer", respect for fellow collectors and a lack of trully justified responses to many pointed comments and questions.

Oh and most venereal word imaginable - censorship! ;) 


Oh, Ok.  Seeing it from a different angle.  Yeah, why the hell would you out a poster auctions unless you thought it would help the members of the forum?  I guess it really comes down to "Does this post help forum members?".  Else, live sideline auction commentary may not be the best thing for those bidding...

Offline ATLfun

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #1433 on: October 16, 2011, 06:17:54 PM »

Oh, Ok.  Seeing it from a different angle.  Yeah, why the hell would you out a poster auctions unless you thought it would help the members of the forum?  I guess it really comes down to "Does this post help forum members?".  Else, live sideline auction commentary may not be the best thing for those bidding...




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« Last Edit: October 16, 2011, 06:18:36 PM by ATLfun »
   "Please step away from the keyboard.  In my unsolicited opinion, you paid too much for your poster," said APF Price Police Officer Thierry.  




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Offline Harry Caul

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #1434 on: October 16, 2011, 06:28:15 PM »
It obvious to you that we would be hypocrites, how did you arrive at that? I have never outed an auction in this thread. You do know how much work it would be to out all the auctions I come across.  Thousands a week; be realistic here.  But if you really think about it, the general trend takes you to Mel's conclusion regarding the expected ending price of the poster.  My point was that if you didn't already know about it then you have a weak game anyway.  I haven't been in this dog fight and haven't presented any rules other than the few courtesies for thought. Again, I don't know who you think your responding to, but like I said I haven't actually outed any auctions in this thread other than the one I mentioned that should be in this thread (I searched to confirm this).  I have no dog in this fight; I am just commenting.   In fact I stated I could easily see both sides of the argument.  And didn't really pick one in absolute terms; more a discussion of both sides the suckiness of what Mel did but perhaps why he did it and shouldn't be hung for it...

I'm sorry if I misunderstood you, I was calling Mel hypocritical as he doesn't seem to be in favor of 'outing' posters that he is bidding on, but that once it crosses his personal price or interest threshold, then it would be ok.  That is hypocritical by definition.  It sounded like you were trying to use the same circumspect reasoning to justify 'outing' Bond posters (high price bracket, widely collected, 'etc...), but presumably not other posters that you yourself collect.  If that is not what you were trying to communicate, I'm sorry if I took it the wrong way.
« Last Edit: October 16, 2011, 06:29:06 PM by Harry Caul »

Charlie

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #1435 on: October 17, 2011, 12:15:45 AM »
I'm sorry if I misunderstood you, I was calling Mel hypocritical as he doesn't seem to be in favor of 'outing' posters that he is bidding on, but that once it crosses his personal price or interest threshold, then it would be ok.  That is hypocritical by definition.  It sounded like you were trying to use the same circumspect reasoning to justify 'outing' Bond posters (high price bracket, widely collected, 'etc...), but presumably not other posters that you yourself collect.  If that is not what you were trying to communicate, I'm sorry if I took it the wrong way.

No problem, I can see why you might draw this conclusion. I had just picked up the "seed" of the conversation being about a Bond poster. I was thinking that the argument was about outing a poster to inform members that the auction itself was ongoing.  I was under the assumption that Mel was attempting to inform forum members about an auction they might want to bid on; in a helpful way.  But now that I look back at the conversation, the gripe was more about his explanation of why he outed the auction.  So your analysis is correct regarding potential hypocrisy.  

In fact this thread is really stupid; 1) Why would I want to create competition. 2) Why would I take the time to out an auction of a poster I don't collect to the general public or forum. 3) If I knew a member was into certain posters and I found an auction, I would just PM them.

If it was a authentication issue, there is a thread for that.  If it was a value issue, there is a thread for that. If it is a dealer, there is a thread for that.  

Just some written thought process here:

So, why does this thread exist again?  My only thought would be to let people know of some nice ongoing auctions, regardless if I am bidding on something in the auction or not.  But, why would I want to create competition?  So then the only reason or logical reason for this thread to exist, is to out auctions that you are not going to bid on anyway...  It may be hypocrisy, but that only makes sense and is the only reason for the thread's existence.  So, pretty much, any posts in this thread are hypocritical by the very nature of the thread itself.

I haven't (in this thread) nor will I be outing any auctions soon. And this hypocritical nature was probably why I felt like I was breaking poster "bro-code" the last time I outed a nice set of auctions; because, I already had the poster and wasn't bidding.  But the interesting thing is, I was actually just wanting forum members to know that there was a very nice daybill auction going...  Now that I know more members, these "outings" take the form of PMs; which is probably the best way to handle situations like this regardless of the current price level...

Else, I'm am not going to tell people about auctions I plan on bidding on (so I might be a hypocrite); and it isn't right to make everyone aware of auctions just because you don't have a dog in the fight. 
But how do you help members out if you don't know what everyone collects; and therefore can't PM them when say an awesome daybill auction is going?  Or a guy is selling a stack of bond posters?  Or even for me; Roland Emmerich is selling his personal set of Stargate concept printer's proofs?
« Last Edit: October 17, 2011, 12:41:55 AM by Charlie »

Offline MoviePosterBid.com

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #1436 on: October 17, 2011, 12:25:30 AM »
is this the correct thread to let people know that my rolled auction 2 auctions from now will have a different Harry Potter international style that no one seems to have sold before.. or is there a thread called "Advanced Screenings of Advanced Posters Soon To Be Auctioned That You Wish Nobody Knew About"?

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Charlie

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #1437 on: October 17, 2011, 12:38:25 AM »
is this the correct thread to let people know that my rolled auction 2 auctions from now will have a different Harry Potter international style that no one seems to have sold before.. or is there a thread called "Advanced Screenings of Advanced Posters Soon To Be Auctioned That You Wish Nobody Knew About"?

That would be "I'm Making Another Dealer Thread Disguised As A Place for Potential Hypocritical Posts for Non-Harry Potter Fans". ASPSTBATYWNKA - Just checking  (I feel an acronym will soon be used)

Your a funny guy Rich...  I need to meet you some day.  :)
« Last Edit: October 17, 2011, 12:38:54 AM by Charlie »

Offline theartofmovieposters

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #1438 on: October 17, 2011, 12:43:37 AM »

Et tu Ves?  Maybe this will calm you down:



Your attitude goes alot towards explaining why you are single...
Ves

Offline theartofmovieposters

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #1439 on: October 17, 2011, 12:43:57 AM »
Personally, making this thread "members only" changes very little.  There is no discussion between members and non-members.  These are issues between existing members and so making the thread "members only" serves little purpose.  

Agree.
Ves

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #1440 on: October 17, 2011, 12:49:46 AM »
Your a funny guy Rich...  I need to meet you some day.  :)

 cheers

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Charlie

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #1441 on: October 17, 2011, 12:58:25 AM »
Agree.

Yes, you guys are probably right.  But the argument was sound; we have to assume forum members are knowledgeable enough to know how to find the stuff they want.  So any outing would just benefit the idiots and the guests.

Offline Neo

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #1442 on: October 17, 2011, 08:36:26 AM »
Wow, you guys don't mess around with people outing auctions!  :o  Does it irritate, offend, or piss some people off to out auctions?  YES.  That is why I don't do it (except one thread where I mentioned a woman on Ebay had a bunch of video posters that were selling for next to nothing, and she now has more negatives than anyone I've ever seen on Ebay - my apologies if anyone got screwed from that "outing").  

As we all know, there are items that are not noticed by the masses or even another person interested in that item, as I'm sure many of us have paid significantly less on various things that have sold for much higher prices elsewhere, and saving money is generally a good thing, unless someone is getting blatantly ripped off.  I think most people are "jumping the gun" on this topic, since I'm pretty sure it's safe to say that most people complaining and/or reading this here have not been watching an auction they were hoping to get a good deal on outed at this joint, and a lot of people are expressing their concern that they do not want an auction or item they are watching to be outed in the future.

"So any outing would just benefit the idiots and the guests."  Charlie, that is a bold statement.  A perfect example for the falseness of this statement is for one item I literally checked on a daily basis for well over a year, and did not see for sale, then I quit looking for a few months, and one day out of the blue I decided to look and voila, there it was.  An item that there are probably extremely few copies of in existence, and I was lucky enough to score it for the opening bid.  There are other examples also, and I'll just leave it at that.  With 7 day auctions, if people don't check within that time frame, then they of course miss the auction.  Same for "B.I.N." items.  One could sell a few minutes after being listed, and if someone is not checking numerous times per day, he/she will not win an item like that.  It's a harsh statement to call someone an "idiot" for not seeing an item listed, and if guests don't want to join in on the conversation here, that is their prerogative and they should not be treated like outsiders because they choose to not participate in the talk.  And they outnumber members many times over, so that's another reason to not demean them, and I'm not saying that you were demeaning them, Charlie, I'm just saying that I've seen a few comments about guests and they were not exactly in a positive context.

This joint is about FUN, so I can see why Mel and others would mention some current auctions, as some are comical, shocking, etc.  I'm not gonna act like someone peed in my Cheerios, because no one has, but I will say I would appreciate it if no one does at some point in the future.
« Last Edit: October 17, 2011, 09:07:53 AM by NeoLoco »

Offline Neo

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #1443 on: October 17, 2011, 09:09:06 AM »
A picture says a thousand words.



Charlie

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #1444 on: October 17, 2011, 09:28:24 AM »
"So any outing would just benefit the idiots and the guests."  Charlie, that is a bold statement.  

Your right this is a harsh statement.  I apologize if I offended anyone. My point was that if there is a poster you really want; one that you would buy or bid on as soon as it is available, you should already be using the tools such as saved searches and want lists to let you know when its up. 

 

Offline ATLfun

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #1445 on: October 17, 2011, 10:28:33 AM »
is this the correct thread to let people know that my rolled auction 2 auctions from now will have a different Harry Potter international style that no one seems to have sold before.. or is there a thread called "Advanced Screenings of Advanced Posters Soon To Be Auctioned That You Wish Nobody Knew About"?

  That would be a Holiday call.  But, it seems that dealers already have several avenues to advertise their auctions without using the "mid-auction" thread.

  Of course, I think your just poking fun at everyone, which is cool.   ;D  And since I was the underbidder to that stinking Rattler on the last Int. HP, I am sure that my interest will be piqued again.


  Brian
   "Please step away from the keyboard.  In my unsolicited opinion, you paid too much for your poster," said APF Price Police Officer Thierry.  




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Offline ddilts399

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #1446 on: October 17, 2011, 11:08:09 AM »
is this the correct thread to let people know that my rolled auction 2 auctions from now will have a different Harry Potter international style that no one seems to have sold before.. or is there a thread called "Advanced Screenings of Advanced Posters Soon To Be Auctioned That You Wish Nobody Knew About"?

Now come on Rich. If I sell something, I want people to link, talk, post pictures whatever to get more hits and interest. If I am buying something, I dont want anyone to know about it. These posts some have made of "I dont care who knows about what I am bidding on" makes no since unless A) the poster is something not many people have interest in or B) you have a lot of money and don't care what anything costs you.

If the poster is in demand and it gets posted in this thread, it raises the sale price, period. Anyone who thinks otherwise is fooling themselves.

 

guest8

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #1447 on: October 17, 2011, 11:28:13 AM »
Now come on Rich. If I sell something, I want people to link, talk, post pictures whatever to get more hits and interest. If I am buying something, I dont want anyone to know about it. These posts some have made of "I dont care who knows about what I am bidding on" makes no since unless A) the poster is something not many people have interest in or B) you have a lot of money and don't care what anything costs you.

If the poster is in demand and it gets posted in this thread, it raises the sale price, period. Anyone who thinks otherwise is fooling themselves.

 

I agree with Dale BUT .. There's no way to prove if this thread really raises the final sale price higher than it would have gotten on its own .. granted being in here it minimizes the odds of it going for well below average .. But we can never know for sure if posting these auctions in here will actually make the final price higher than it would have been had we not seen it .. Not every bidder is on APF and Im sure there are a lot more bidders that do their own automated searches for highly desirable pieces on the off chance they can catch one on a good day.

Offline MoviePosterBid.com

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #1448 on: October 17, 2011, 05:26:55 PM »
Dale.. it isn't that I disagree with some of what you say, but the object of forums is to share.
Of course, I don't think I've posted a pending auction to this thread maybe once, but the right to post is what I fight for and concerning the subsequent post from fallenangel, I totally agree that any results from this thread are completely intangible unless someone were to say flatly "I only knew about this item because I saw it posted in this thread, and had I not seen it, it would have sold for far less than I paid"

by the way, in case it has been forgotten to older members and is unknown to newer members:
this thread was started as a direct result of a member (Carson Cockman) wanting to censor such posts, which both Thierry and Holiday thought was onerous and I have an analogy from a different medium that speaks to exactly this kind of stuff.
In poker, there is always someone who raises before the flop (in holdem or omaha). many people don't like that kind of action and complain. But the facts are, the person is allowed to raise at any time as long as it's his turn and the rules do not prohibit such action (and no such action is or will ever be prohibited).

yu gotta go with teh flow..

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Re: Mid-auction analysis - OMGs!, LOLs!, WTFs!, whatev....
« Reply #1449 on: October 17, 2011, 05:28:32 PM »
A picture says a thousand words.



I'm not worried, although I do have some chafing

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