Can a tiger change its stripes?

[Bruce]

I have noticed something lately. As eBay's implosion continues, many former buyers of ours (ones who were kicked off for non-payment) have been applying for reinstatement.

Of course they SAY they will never do that again, but my past findings have been that someone who has burned us once is FAR more likely to burn us again than other customers (and I believe in the old saying, "Fool me once and shame on you, fool me twice and shame on me").

It is incredibly unfair to the honest bidders to have ones who bid and never pay, because they often cause the honest bidders to pay more than they should when they lose, and when they win and don't pay, we have a dissatisfied consignor and have to do twice the work by auctioning it again.

Thoughts?

[50s]

Less competition the better

[CSM]

"Banish him!"

[pratschm]

Of course they SAY they will never do that again, but my past findings have been that someone who has burned us once is FAR more likely to burn us again than other customers (and I believe in the old saying, "Fool me once and shame on you, fool me twice and shame on me").

It is incredibly unfair to the honest bidders to have ones who bid and never pay, because they often cause the honest bidders to pay more than they should when they lose, and when they win and don't pay, we have a dissatisfied consignor and have to do twice the work by auctioning it again.

I think that says it all.

However, here is a suggestion, but it comes with extra effort on your part, which is completely unfair to you for their misbehavior. Perhaps allow them to be reinstated but in a limited capacity. For example (arbitrary numbers used here), they can only bid on 1-2 items per auction for 5 auctions to build back good standing. If all goes well, you have a paying customer back. If not, banished for life. Not sure of the logistics required to do such bookkeeping, though.

I guess it all depends on how badly you need more customers and whether their possible repeat offense is worth the hassle to you and your loyal customers. Right now it sounds like they need you more than you need them. Of course, every case is different (legitimate hardship vrs innate jackhole).

[paul waines]

If it was my business, I would not re-instate non-paying bidders, Why should these people get a second chance?  I'd expect honesty from a seller, and I'd expect the same from buyers.

Even if I regret buying a poster, I would still pay-up, No questions. Anyone who doesn't pay-up should be Booted out.. Your running a business not a charity.  

[Silhouette]

Of course they SAY they will never do that again, but my past findings have been that someone who has burned us once is FAR more likely to burn us again than other customers (and I believe in the old saying, "Fool me once and shame on you, fool me twice and shame on me").

To err is human to forgive is divine (Alexander Pope)

Perhaps rather than having a blanket rule I personally would review each on its merits when receiving an application for reinstatement. Strikes me that not everyone intentionally would mean to not pay. Certainly a third strike and you're out.

Then again, as a bidder, there is an attraction in what Steve has to say.   

Less competition the better

Anyway, what happens to the item when not paid for, do you offer it to the under bidder at their losing bid?

[Severen]

Probably too hard to set up but the thing to do would be to make them use "front money" Bruce. Another words they would have to have money on deposit to use for purchases.

[jayn_j]

Probably too hard to set up but the thing to do would be to make them use "front money" Bruce. Another words they would have to have money on deposit to use for purchases.

I responded on MOPO and went a step further.  Make them post a $500 bond that just sits there for 6 months.  After 6 months of payments, the bond can then be used for puurchases.  If they fail to pay on anything, the bond is forefit.

[MoviePosterBid.com]

I have reinstated a few people on MoviePosterBid
every last one of them was a disappointment the second time around also.

I'm getting ready to ban a few more people, including 2 serious collectors who haven't answered repeated emails for payments and should have been banned many weeks ago. I've been overly fair to them, why do they suck so bad??

[holiday]

Everyone desserves at least one second chance.

Amazingly enough, as I write this, even Carson.

[Silhouette]

To err is human to forgive is divine (Alexander Pope)

I would add that all my years running a multi-million dollar business with maybe a thousand customers never once did a bad payer become a good payer.

They went on cash with order

[guest4208]

I get plenty of non payers through eBay and always block them and file non paying bidder claims just to get my fees back. Occasionally, they ask to be reinstated and I usually do that.

I also think that sellers should make it as easy as possible to pay. That means sending an invoice with postage included and a direct link to be able to pay by paypal. If you do that you are less likely to have non payers.

I have never liked Heritage's policy of adding shipping later. You never know how much you are going to be charged - which is a real issue for international bidders.

[ATLfun]

   
 I have to agree with not allowing non-paying bidders back.  It is not fair to honest buyers who might have been bid up as part of a game.  There are people who enjoy running up auctions.  Then, when they accidentally win, they run and hide.  I would be disappointed in emovie if they let non-paying bidders back in the game.

[Zorba]

Everyone desserves at least one second chance.

Amazingly enough, as I write this, even Carson.

You are a better man than I... but I do assume that you mean after he corrects his wrong against you?

Cause I think I would just beat his face with a baseball bat.  

[oldposterho]

(and I believe in the old saying, "Fool me once and shame on you, fool me twice and shame on me").

I believe the correct quote is, and you're close enough to Texas for it to be the case, "Fool me once, shame on you, fool me...you can't get fooled again."

Compelling arguments for both sides of the question, I'm more with Paul though.  Personally I hate getting dicked around and if they'll do it once...

I imagine there are legitimate cases - hospitalization, etc., but it does seem like if they didn't try to make it right when they recontacted you to get back on board you'd have to wonder about their sincerity.

--Peter

[Bruce]

Great posts!

First off, I am mostly talking about the people who just completely vanish (we call it "pulling a Carson").

If someone is a man (or woman) about it, and admits they lost their job the next day (or more likely, lost their head in the auction) then I tend to give them one more chance. But we super-carefully document it and there is NEVER any further chances. AND I keep them on a tight leash.

The ones I am more talking about are like Carson himself. They completely vanish, and then two or three years later, when they are tired of solely buying from anyone but us, then send a message that they are sorry about what occurred, and that they promise to be good. Of course they know I have long since re-auctioned the items, so there is no penalty for them.

I DO evaluate these on a case by case basis. I just wanted to hear your thoughts.

We DO maintain over a 99% collection rate, and I know that is mostly due to bidders knowing that they CAN'T simply re-up (as they can just about everywhere else) and due to them knowing they risk a lifetime ban.

[holiday]

I have never liked Heritage's policy of adding shipping later. You never know how much you are going to be charged - which is a real issue for international bidders.

Oh, you KNOW what you're going to get charged for shipping by them - A FUCK OF A LOT!

[CSM]

It's completely unfair to the underbidders when people "lose their heads" and don't own up to it by not paying.

So that's at least 3 people screwed by one asshole - the underbidder, Bruce and the consignor!

[50s]

Of course they know I have long since re-auctioned the items, so there is no penalty for them.

If someone doesnt pay, it sounds like you re-auction the item. Does the consignor get paid as if the original sale was successfully paid for and you then own the withheld poster to auction again later? I assume the consignor is told their poster must be auctioned again at a later date.  

If this is the case, I wonder if consignors are happy about that experience? Would it not be better to give the consignor the sale and wear the possible loss (if it reauctions next time for less)?

Probably it has to be re-auctioned I guess to avoid polluting the emovieposter results database with incorrect sales data.

[50s]

So that's at least 3 people screwed by one asshole

Yes, it is time for the tables to be turned! - at least 3 people screw one asshole instead!

[CSM]

Yes, it is time for the tables to be turned! - at least 3 people screw one asshole instead!

I am not volunteering for that turn table