Author Topic: Media players. i.e. Apple tv  (Read 45067 times)

Offline CJ138

  • Collector
  • ***
  • Posts: 903
Media players. i.e. Apple tv
« on: October 16, 2011, 01:28:15 PM »
After seeing my buddy's Apple TV setup, I decided I wanted to invest in a media player.  I bought a WDTV (Western Digital).  I only spent about $40 and hooked up an external HD to store my dvd files on.  I am pretty frustrated because the sound loses sync.  Not every movie, every time, but enough that it is a pain in the ass. I should note that this sync issue occurs after I compress the movie to an MKV file.  Also, mp4 formated files have a sort of stutter to the video. I did not buy an Apple TV because (sigh) none of my televisions have an HDMI hookup.  Has anyone here used and endorse a particualr media player?

Conor
Lowering the brow of APF since 2010.

guest8

  • Guest
Re: Media players. i.e. Apple tv
« Reply #1 on: October 16, 2011, 08:55:22 PM »
I used my PS3 for a long time .. But now I just use a computer that has an HDMI out and run the program Boxee on there and I love that. Boxee will play anything I throw at it except for bluray ISO's .. dvd ISO's play perfectly .. But something about a bluray ISO it wont read .. But MKV, AVI whatever it does it and the best part is if you already have a PC the program is free!! :)

Offline Tob

  • Administrator
  • Hoarder
  • *****
  • Posts: 1969
Re: Media players. i.e. Apple tv
« Reply #2 on: November 22, 2011, 07:43:45 AM »
Old thread - but I'd recommend a small PC and a copy of XBMC which is an excellent piece of free software. It has a sound synch control so that you can adjust the sound to re-synch where necessary. Either that or buy a new surround sound amp which with a sound delay/synch control on it.

guest8

  • Guest
Re: Media players. i.e. Apple tv
« Reply #3 on: November 22, 2011, 08:40:03 AM »
Old thread - but I'd recommend a small PC and a copy of XBMC which is an excellent piece of free software. It has a sound synch control so that you can adjust the sound to re-synch where necessary. Either that or buy a new surround sound amp which with a sound delay/synch control on it.

Yes, I even stopped using my PS3 and have a PC thats running Boxee (software that uses XBMC) .. Its free and really a great product .. I share all of my drives from multiple computers across my network and it will stream the data from those computers .. That way you do not have to invest in multiple external hard drives.

Offline 50s

  • Curator
  • *****
  • Posts: 5630
  • Steve
Re: Media players. i.e. Apple tv
« Reply #4 on: June 21, 2013, 11:23:37 PM »
At the moment I am spending time building a standalone playing device putting a collection of movies together for an older person. I am after a simple box/component to put alongside the dvd player.

I am thinking of (WD TV Live SMP). This is a new version to what CJ was using (in first post) I believe so hopefully it will work better. I will plug in a 4TB USB3 drive. This will be a non network set up as the person is not tech savy. There will be 300-600 movies and about 50 music albums on it.

I am also planning on setting up a networked version for myself (pc to tv). I think I will use XBMC software and am currently prepping all the media using software: ThumbGen (to create metadata, covers, movie sheets).

No real question here, just maybe someone is doing something similar...?


Offline enki

  • Collector
  • ***
  • Posts: 654
Re: Media players. i.e. Apple tv
« Reply #5 on: June 22, 2013, 09:01:00 AM »
I've been a big fan of the WD-TV product for a while. I had the original (non-networked) version, the WD-TV Live and the WD-TV Live Plus. I loved their simple design, straight forward interface, the ability to stream via SMB from my servers and the fact that they could play practically anything.  I haven't purchased the newer model, since the Live Plus worked fine for me, but I've heard that it's interface is much more....cluttered and it is more locked down, but I can't say for certain.

In any case, about three months ago I picked up a Roku 3. The first thing that I noticed as that it couldn't really stream local media like the WD-TV could. As I am a big downloader, that was a problem for me. After doing some research, I came across Plex Media Server. It's a free media server software package that is just amazing. Not only can it transcode depending on the client device capability, but it automatically indexes, pulls IMDB data, will track watched/progress, auto-categorized, etc. etc. The server software even runs on Linux, a big plus for me, and they have client software out there for almost every OS/device, including the Roku.

So the conjunction of Plex + Roku has really made me consider retiring my other WD-TVs.

Offline 50s

  • Curator
  • *****
  • Posts: 5630
  • Steve
Re: Media players. i.e. Apple tv
« Reply #6 on: June 22, 2013, 09:34:33 AM »
Thanks Enki, I will investigate your set up


Offline Tob

  • Administrator
  • Hoarder
  • *****
  • Posts: 1969
Re: Media players. i.e. Apple tv
« Reply #7 on: June 22, 2013, 04:17:30 PM »
I used to use a WDTV, but have since bought a small pc (revo 3700) and use XBMC...it's a terrific bit of software. The scrapers do everything for you in terms of cover art and metadata (no need for thumbgen), the UI is responsive and customisable, it plays everything and it has some really useful features such as being able to adjust soundtrack timings for lip synching issues.

It's not for everyone (the simplest option suits some folk) and the WDTV option is an excellent piece of kit too, but XBMC is really excellent.

Offline 50s

  • Curator
  • *****
  • Posts: 5630
  • Steve
Re: Media players. i.e. Apple tv
« Reply #8 on: June 22, 2013, 11:59:35 PM »
Thanks Tob. A pc component with XBMC sounds a good way to go as I guess I could display any internet site on the tv and use a tablet as the interface. Better still if I could cram in a couple of 4TB disks.

 

Repto

  • Guest
Re: Media players. i.e. Apple tv
« Reply #9 on: June 24, 2013, 03:23:23 PM »
I am very interested in all this. I desperately want to be a cable cutter, I am fed up of spending over $100 a week on Satellite for 200 channels of crud and six channels I actually watch. I am also an ex-pat and sorely miss my BBC fix and Radio 4 Panel shows. The future seems so close but it is still a swirling mess of almost-there solutions.

There are some great freeware solutions out there, as mentioned XBMC and all sorts of ways of making the Internet or downloaded content more transparent. The legitimate services like Netflix, Hulu, Crackle, Vudu etc are close but no banana, content is still being jealously hoarded by the old media. The illegitimate services like Torrents, Usenet and streaming can work really well but I am a big girls blouse and would prefer to not have to so heavily rely on something illegal. There are some great devices, Roku, Tivo, Boxee and a emerging group of Android or Raspberry Pi based commercial implementations of XBMC.

All of it is close but won't mean anything until somebody comes up with the one-device-to-bind-them that my parents, my wife and the 12:00 blinking VCR people can cope with. It's all still way too techie. I enjoy it, but XBMC can be frustrating, along with all the backend, frontend and witsend apps like Sickbeard, tvheadend, mezzmo, etc, etc, etc. The killer app is not there yet, XBMC is close but still takes too much fishing around in wikis to make work properly. I no longer need a VPN thanks to Uno Telly but I suspect that DNS loophole may get closed sooner or later.

In my opinion you have to have one device as the portal to it all, that meets what the Cable Cutting websites call the Wife Acceptance Factor (WAF). For some people this is an Apple TV, a boxee or in my case a Tivo. I have a Antenna on my roof and a Tivo taking care of time shifting all the broadcast US TV. Up until recently all I had was a small footprint Shuttle XPC always on and connected directly by HDMI to the TV, serving torrent downloaded Brit TV to my Tivo with Streambaby. I can of course get to everything directly using a wireless mouse and Windows 7 on the PC, but I have found that doesn't meet the WAF. It is much more harmonious in the house if it all gets integrated together more or less seamlessly by the Tivo with no change of HDMI input required and One True Remote. This has its problems, Tivo has not kept up with the times well and their native apps are useless. There are a lot of free Apps out there though, like streambaby, that make it work the way it should. I don't think you can beat the Tivo as a DVR on the normal broadcast TV, plus it is a good portal to Netflix, Hulu, Amazon and You Tube which it makes all searchable. However, if Boxee gets their act together and comes up with a decent Cloud DVR, or someone else does, then I think the Tivo is toast long term.

There are almost there solutions circling the vortex of confusion like Alki David's media defying Filmon.com which is bound to end up in the courts sooner or later. It very nearly does everything I want, including being able to record UK TV to the cloud. I think the cloud, or Video Napster II will eventually kill the DVR as it itself did the VCR.

Interesting times...meanwhile the MPAA/RIAA industry resists to the bitter end.

guest8

  • Guest
Re: Media players. i.e. Apple tv
« Reply #10 on: June 24, 2013, 04:53:37 PM »
My gawd that was hard to read!! :)

After getting through it .. i have to say that I don't think there will ever be "one device to rule them all" .. and that's just because all of the networks want their $$ .. They will black out certain channels and programs across certain parts of the country so that advertisers get what they want and they get paid. So far the safest, cheaper all around solution is a combination of Usenet and something like Sickbeard/NZBDrone/Couchpotato/Headphones and XBMC on a HTPC. The cheapest would be torrents but you run the risk of your ISP banning you for illegal content.

Short of that there will never be an all in one solution .. because everyone wants their cut of the pie and they will not let someone else get more money than they feel that they deserve.

Even Boxee sold out when they stopped updating their PC app, it was a nice software and then they just kept adding "buy from me" apps to their line up and eventually stopped supporting their free PC app and went to working only with the DLINK Boxee Box.

Repto

  • Guest
Re: Media players. i.e. Apple tv
« Reply #11 on: June 24, 2013, 06:34:49 PM »
My gawd that was hard to read!! :)

After getting through it .. i

OK then.

Offline Silhouette

  • Hoarder
  • ****
  • Posts: 3866
Re: Media players. i.e. Apple tv
« Reply #12 on: June 24, 2013, 06:59:10 PM »
So, what you're saying...this is no good?

David


Repto

  • Guest
Re: Media players. i.e. Apple tv
« Reply #13 on: June 24, 2013, 07:49:23 PM »
So, what you're saying...this is no good?

Brilliant! I love that some people are taking the innards out of Olde radios, music centers and huge but beautiful examples of cabinet making from when valves kept the room toasty and putting digital inside them as servers, players and streamers. I wish I had kept some stuff like this around.

Offline enki

  • Collector
  • ***
  • Posts: 654
Re: Media players. i.e. Apple tv
« Reply #14 on: June 24, 2013, 10:16:09 PM »
I agree that the only way to really cut the cord and get ALL the content an average person would want would require illegal downloads.

Even if one is willing to pay for the standard streaming offerings (ie: Hulu Plus, Netflix), you still can't get access to some channels/shows without having a cable subscription (ie: HBO Go). In that case, the parent company (Time Warner - go figure) has refused to allow people to just pay for that service. Will that stance change in the future? I believe so. But expect to pay a premium. And even if you have the full tier of cable channels and get the add-on streaming offerings, you still can't watch everything on a media streamer.

And don't get me started on those BS "over 500 channels!" claims by devices like Roku. First, half of them are craptacular religious broadcasts. Out of the remaining ones, about half of those are low-quality podcasts. Out of the remainder, half of those are obscure movies that 99.9999% of people have no interest in. And then you have the crappy channels like SciFi which only gives clips and previews of upcoming shows. On the Roku, out of their hundreds of "channels", there might be a dozen that are worth watching.

I wouldn't mind paying for legal content if I got what I wanted from that. But that will never happen, so I'll just stick to torrents.

guest8

  • Guest
Re: Media players. i.e. Apple tv
« Reply #15 on: June 25, 2013, 06:17:14 AM »
OK then.

Out of everything I said that all you commented on? :) I really wasn't trying to offend.. just different writing styles I guess.. I even said it with a :) !! :)  :)

Offline lynaron

  • Collector
  • ***
  • Posts: 618
Re: Media players. i.e. Apple tv
« Reply #16 on: June 25, 2013, 04:35:17 PM »
Well.  I read this whole thread and didn't understand 99% of what was said. But my cell phone is so old it has a hand crank and I solved the blinking 12:00 with a piece of black vinyl tape  I'm just not a techno savage I guess :P.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2013, 04:36:23 PM by lynaron »
I'll raise a glass to the illusion but drink to the reality.

Offline Silhouette

  • Hoarder
  • ****
  • Posts: 3866
Re: Media players. i.e. Apple tv
« Reply #17 on: June 25, 2013, 05:25:58 PM »
In a perfect world I'd like a media server that I can dump all my DVDs onto which I can then access from any TV that is connected to this 'media server'. I haven't looked in a while as yet I haven't found anything that has a UI (User Interface) that looks nice and is easy to use by (say) my 80 year old ma-in-law when she visits (actually my wife too who is almost as much of a Luddite). Also ripping DVDs to computer is ridiculously slow.

So if someone has a solution that...do post
David


guest8

  • Guest
Re: Media players. i.e. Apple tv
« Reply #18 on: June 25, 2013, 07:41:52 PM »
In a perfect world I'd like a media server that I can dump all my DVDs onto which I can then access from any TV that is connected to this 'media server'. I haven't looked in a while as yet I haven't found anything that has a UI (User Interface) that looks nice and is easy to use by (say) my 80 year old ma-in-law when she visits (actually my wife too who is almost as much of a Luddite). Also ripping DVDs to computer is ridiculously slow.

So if someone has a solution that...do post

Honestly XBMC is really easy to use.. You just have to get it set up and scan your media files. Then it just list or shows thumbnails of all your movies and you select on and go. You can use Windows Media Center Remote controls to make it more like "Watching TV" rather than using a computer.

The way mines set up all I have to do when I get home is turn on the tuner and TV and my computer is already running.. I can open my TV shows section and go through all the new stuff that downloaded over night or I can go into the Movies section and go though the poster art of all the movies that I have, until I find something I want to watch.

As for ripping a DVD ... I gave up on that.. its easier and WAY faster to download a bluray rip of the movies that you own and better quality than any DVD rip that I'd make.

Offline CJ138

  • Collector
  • ***
  • Posts: 903
Re: Media players. i.e. Apple tv
« Reply #19 on: June 25, 2013, 08:14:12 PM »
I thought I would add to this. I have since retired the old WDTV. I currently have an Apple TV 3 hooked to my projector and a Sony SMP N100 hooked to my non-hdmi tv.  They both work well but I prefer the Apple tv.  I have had virtually no problems with the Apple tv, however, some occasional stuttering with the Sony. 

Conor
Lowering the brow of APF since 2010.

Offline 50s

  • Curator
  • *****
  • Posts: 5630
  • Steve
Re: Media players. i.e. Apple tv
« Reply #20 on: June 26, 2013, 10:01:18 AM »
Well.  I read this whole thread and didn't understand 99% of what was said. But my cell phone is so old it has a hand crank and I solved the blinking 12:00 with a piece of black vinyl tape  I'm just not a techno savage I guess :P.


I am hearing you Lyn. I reckon I am not far from putting computers in the all to hard basket, and I'll add a waste of time/life too.


The way mines set up all I have to do when I get home is turn on the tuner and TV and my computer is already running.. I can open my TV shows section and go through all the new stuff that downloaded over night or I can go into the Movies section and go though the poster art of all the movies that I have, until I find something I want to watch.

So you point the remote at the computer to navigate the tv?




Well I am planning for two setups as mentioned:
1.) One setup is for a friend who cant figure out which remote is for what, and
2.) The other will be something for me more technical

For:
1.) I have now bought a WD TV Live SMP box for about $120. I will attach a hard disk(s) to it with the movies put on it. That can sit amongst my friends other components ie dvd, set top box. He can just use the included remote to look up a movie to watch (or listen to music albums if I add them too). Inbuilt wifi can connect to internet to show some internet sites on the tv like ABC iView or youtube. The wifi connection can also connect to computers for access to more movies if desired. I think its the best bang for the buck and easy(ish) to use - turn on the box and use the remote control navigation to find a movie.
2.) Not to sure about this but due to quite a number of people have streaming issues (wifi), I prefer the HTPC component solution (similar to above) with hard disk directly connected however I envisage quite a large stack of connected hard drives in the near future (e.g. 3 x 4TB disks).

Well, I am just concentration on 1.) at the moment.

Currently I have XBMC installed on my pc with a HDMI cable to the tv (then optical from tv into amp). However currently I just use potplayer (video software) installed on the pc and I open the video file and press play (wireless keyboard to control it). I have a web page listing movies I can send to a friend they can look at and click the link to read up on it on IMDB and then choose one in advance of arriving rather than deciding on the night if they like. The web page is generated mostly automatically so is easy to update.



guest8

  • Guest
Re: Media players. i.e. Apple tv
« Reply #21 on: June 26, 2013, 12:21:28 PM »
So you point the remote at the computer to navigate the tv?

Yes, but I have completely cut the cord .. So I don't use my TV for anything other than accessing XBMC. I do have a friend that has an OTA HDTV antenna that he uses with Windows Media Center and a MCE iR remote. You have to have a TV tuner card in the PC as well but he can pull in live/local channels pretty well with that too. My firend pretty much uses MCE exclusively though, I tried that but my movie library is so large it seemed to lock up MCE trying to pull all the data and list it for me, so, I stuck with XBMC.

Also, my HTPC is just below my Tuner which is just below my TV. So pointing a remote at the TV or Computer is pretty much the same thing. I also have multiple ways of controlling my HTPC, two of which are Bluetooth so it doesn't matter what I point it at it navigates the PC.

I have this Nuvi by Logitech.
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0011FOOI2

Also this Logitech "PS3" Bluetooth Keyboard that works just fine on a PC.
http://www.amazon.com/Logitech-PlayStation-3-Cordless-MediaBoard-Pro/dp/B000W5RBQE

And XBMC can work with many of the iR Windows Media Center Remotes like these. (some take some configuring others do most actions with no help from configs or other softwares)
http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss_1?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=windows+mce+remote&rh=i%3Aaps%2Ck%3Awindows+mce+remote

Here is my living room set up.. you can see the TV with the Tuner/speakers, Wii and the HTPC just below everything.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-L6HOA1Vec_w/UXc1rnFSaII/AAAAAAAAI4U/QnMYb1-U_As/w731-h548-no/IMG_0536.JPG

In my home theater room the tuner and projector are above and behind us and the PC is to the left and behind us. To turn the projector and tuner on and to adjust the volume I have to point those remotes back but the Bluetooth keyboard (Nuvi) I don't have to worry about any of that.


As for your first set up .. does WDTV not have an Ethernet port for network streaming? I have tried streaming with PS3 over WIFI and it works most of the time but when you get into HD content I ran into issues with stutter and freezing. So I hard line everything in all the time now. I know the Roku has an Ethernet port.. but I am not sure it can see network shares without any additional software/plug-in though. My mother-in-law watches Netflix all the time and we got her a Roku so that she could watch it on her TV and she loves it. The new Roku 3 is only $99 IIRC.

As for your setup, depending on the size of your movie collection and if you download new content frequently. I'd suggest having two PC's one tucked away somewhere that is your file server (has tons of big hard drives) and then you can buy (or build) a smaller/cheaper HTPC. That's how I have mine set up, I currently have ~5-6TB worth of data storage with movies and TV shows on them. Cramming all that into a HTPC would make it noisy and/or you'd have a ton of external HDD's all over your your HT cabinet/table.

If you have any issue getting Ethernet to your HTPC for faster streaming, I'd suggest one of these.. I have the cheaper/slower one and it works for me. They didn't have the faster one when I bought mine or I'd have bought it instead. (Gotta have the bestest and fastest) :P

http://www.amazon.com/NETGEAR-Powerline-Network-Adapter-XAVB5004/dp/B004PA9PBQ/ref=sr_1_2?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1372263041&sr=1-2&keywords=XAVB1004

http://www.amazon.com/NETGEAR-XAVB1004-100NAS-Theater-Internet-Connection/dp/B002FB684E/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1372263041&sr=1-1&keywords=XAVB1004

Also, I needed multiple Ethernet ports due to my Wii, HTPC and the TV being hooked up tot he internet. If you only need 1 port for the HTPC there are cheaper versions with the faster speed. It just depends on what all you'd like to connect.

Also, you mentioned a web page that you/your friends can look at movies.. I just happened to find this add on that can make your HTPC accessible from anywhere..

http://htpc.io/

Now i haven't used or tested that, so I have no idea how well it works vs. how easy it is to setup and maintain.

If you are really wanting a project, I've been meaning to setup a new File Server with Amahi, it replaces windows and it's sole purpose is to store/maintain media files and make them accessible from anywhere. The Amahi install takes the place of whatever OS you have (Windows/Linux) so you need a PC to install it on. That's the only reason I haven't tried it.. I don't have a spare PC to test it on and I don't want to wipe out my current file server on the off chance that I don't car for Amahi.

www.amahi.org

Offline 50s

  • Curator
  • *****
  • Posts: 5630
  • Steve
Re: Media players. i.e. Apple tv
« Reply #22 on: June 26, 2013, 09:06:48 PM »
Great, thanks for all the information fallen. The WD TV Live SMP does have one ethernet port to connect a cable to the NAS/computer. Connecting to the pc network via the house power supply also sounds a good way to declutter cables. I'll have a good reread of the above again.

Offline 50s

  • Curator
  • *****
  • Posts: 5630
  • Steve
Re: Media players. i.e. Apple tv
« Reply #23 on: June 27, 2013, 09:05:26 AM »
Well after about 8 hours I got the WD TV Live box setup reading movies from my pc over wifi (I have no ethernet cable at the mo) and now testing playing The Raven movie (small 800MB) and using the remote all sitting in front of the telly, yeah.

Heaven help those that are not IT gurus to figure it out.  Not only did I have to make lots of undocumented (no instructions in the box) changes to Windows Network settings (after reading the interweb inside & out), but also had to find the IP address of the box on the network (in the router software) and add it as a trusted zone in the pc Firewall software...

So now I can start testing the creation of some nice background graphics and cover/box art so it all looks pretty on the screen when reading about each movie in the navigation. When I tested it, I can then move the movies to an external drive and cabled together with the WD TV Live box, give it to a friend.


guest8

  • Guest
Re: Media players. i.e. Apple tv
« Reply #24 on: June 27, 2013, 09:25:25 AM »
Well after about 8 hours I got the WD TV Live box setup reading movies from my pc over wifi (I have no ethernet cable at the mo) and now testing playing The Raven movie (small 800MB) and using the remote all sitting in front of the telly, yeah.

Heaven help those that are not IT gurus to figure it out.  Not only did I have to make lots of undocumented (no instructions in the box) changes to Windows Network settings (after reading the interweb inside & out), but also had to find the IP address of the box on the network (in the router software) and add it as a trusted zone in the pc Firewall software...

So now I can start testing the creation of some nice background graphics and cover/box art so it all looks pretty on the screen when reading about each movie in the navigation. When I tested it, I can then move the movies to an external drive and cabled together with the WD TV Live box, give it to a friend.

Haha .. yeah the undocumented "issues" are always the best to deal with trouble shooting! ;) At least we have google now-a-days! Its a great resource!

Just out of curiosity .. do you have any larger HD files? I would be interested in knowing how it performs streaming a 4-8GB 720/1080p movie over the WIFI signal.