Author Topic: Linen backing & biro writing?  (Read 3623 times)

Offline Test1

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Linen backing & biro writing?
« on: April 02, 2017, 07:39:17 AM »
Hey! guys,

I've read various bits of info on linen backing posters, and it's probably not something I'll ever do myself, but, I was very interested to know if the linen backing process can wash/wipe away biro writing on the "back of a poster" like you get on many older posters were the film title is written down on the back somewhere after it's been folded, or is this something that's impossible to remove?

Cheers! ;)

Offline erik1925

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Re: Linen backing & biro writing?
« Reply #1 on: April 02, 2017, 12:43:26 PM »
Hey John,

That kind of writing (grease pencil etc) can be removed. Things like blue pen and sharpie are whole other critters, tho. Im assuming you are talking pencil, black grease pencil, and that kind of thing? And depending, too, it may come out or lighten when the poster is first washed, too.


-Jeff

Offline Test1

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Re: Linen backing & biro writing?
« Reply #2 on: April 02, 2017, 12:49:51 PM »
Hey John,

That kind of writing (grease pencil etc) can be removed. Things like blue pen and sharpie are whole other critters, tho. Im assuming you are talking pencil, black grease pencil, and that kind of thing? And depending, too, it may come out or lighten when the poster is first washed, too.

I emailed Studio C earlier today to ask this same question, purely just out of interest as much as anything, and they come back to me and said before linen backing is done "everything" is cleaned/washed off first including any ink, so not sure how true all that is and if it's really that easy, I thought biro pen was supposedly very awkward to remove, but, it's the usual thing one person says one thing and the next person says the opposite, so I guess it comes down to who you want to believe.

Offline erik1925

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Re: Linen backing & biro writing?
« Reply #3 on: April 02, 2017, 12:57:59 PM »
What is a biro pen? Im not familiar with that.

And it's likely that there are solvents that can deal with things like sharpie ink (which is supposed to be indelible, remember) but that can of material can also be harsh/tough on the paper itself. Sometimes writing that is stubborn will be gently sanded off, too, like ink stamps that are often on the backs of older US posters.

I personally like the non intrusive writing and stamps on the back, as long as there hasnt been any bleed thru to the front. That writing/stamps is all added info that helps tell the story and history of that poster -- to me, anyhow.

So i dont think anyone is telling you an untruth. Restorers all have their methods and techniques for this kind of issue.


-Jeff

Offline Test1

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Re: Linen backing & biro writing?
« Reply #4 on: April 02, 2017, 01:06:29 PM »
What is a biro pen? Im not familiar with that.

And it's likely that there are solvents that can deal with things like sharpie ink (which is supposed to be indelible, remember) but that can of material can also be harsh/tough on the paper itself. Sometimes writing that is stubborn will be gently sanded off, too, like ink stamps that are often on the backs of older US posters.

I personally like the non intrusive writing and stamps on the back, as long as there hasnt been any bleed thru to the front. That writing/stamps is all added info that helps tell the story and history of that poster -- to me, anyhow.

So i dont think anyone is telling you an untruth. Restorers all have their methods and techniques for this kind of issue.

Biro pen, have you heard of a "Bic" type pen? Bic being the make, that is what I'd call a biro writing pen Jeff. Not sure of any other way of explaining it.

I agree with you writing on the back of something would not normally bother me either, but, I wonder if over time it will gradually show through more? therefore one of my posters I'm a little wary of where the writing on the back is just in case it would eventually bleed through, if I was sure this would never happen I'd happily just forget about it.

Offline erik1925

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Re: Linen backing & biro writing?
« Reply #5 on: April 02, 2017, 01:18:04 PM »
Biro pen, have you heard of a "Bic" type pen? Bic being the make, that is what I'd call a biro writing pen Jeff. Not sure of any other way of explaining it.

I agree with you writing on the back of something would not normally bother me either, but, I wonder if over time it will gradually show through more? therefore one of my posters I'm a little wary of where the writing on the back is just in case it would eventually bleed through, if I was sure this would never happen I'd happily just forget about it.

Hey John, yeah, i know the term 'bic pen,' so biro may be a UK term/name for that same style. Its like blue ball point pen, then, right? This is just my thought, but I think bleed thru happens when the writing or stamp is first applied-- wet ink stamp, fresh pen ink, that can then migrate into the paper fibers and work its way to the front.

I would think that after many years or decades, when that ink has long dried, that there would be little chance of it continuing to "seep thru." I could be wrong, tho, and maybe Dan from Backing To the Future will chime in and give us more detailed infor about this.

I know I have posters from the 30s and 40s that have NSS ink stamps and writing (including black grease pencil, ball point pen ink and lead pencil) on the back, and nothing has appeared on the fronts of these posters in all this time.


-Jeff

Offline Test1

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Re: Linen backing & biro writing?
« Reply #6 on: April 02, 2017, 01:29:38 PM »
Hey John, yeah, i know the term 'bic pen,' so biro may be a UK term/name for that same style. Its like blue ball point pen, then, right? This is just my thought, but I think bleed thru happens when the writing or stamp is first applied-- wet ink stamp, fresh pen ink, that can then migrate into the paper fibers and work its way to the front.

I would think that after many years or decades, when that ink has long dried, that there would be little chance of it continuing to "seep thru." I could be wrong, tho, and maybe Dan from Backing To the Future will chime in and give us more detailed infor about this.

I know I have posters from the 30s and 40s that have NSS ink stamps and writing (including black grease pencil, ball point pen ink and lead pencil) on the back, and nothing has appeared on the fronts of these posters in all this time.

That's correct Jeff, glad I could think of another way to explain it to you thumbsup.gif

That sounds promising from what you've said there Jeff, it's probably just me worrying about nothing, but, as I'm sure you know when you've spent a lot of money on an old film poster you want to be as sure as possible things like this won't ever become a problem.

Offline erik1925

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Re: Linen backing & biro writing?
« Reply #7 on: April 02, 2017, 01:32:10 PM »
Oh, for sure, John. I agree with you totally. Best to ask around and figure it all out, for peace of mind.  :D


-Jeff

Offline erik1925

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Re: Linen backing & biro writing?
« Reply #8 on: April 02, 2017, 02:11:18 PM »
I emailed Studio C earlier today to ask this same question, purely just out of interest as much as anything, and they come back to me and said before linen backing is done "everything" is cleaned/washed off first including any ink, so not sure how true all that is and if it's really that easy, I thought biro pen was supposedly very awkward to remove, but, it's the usual thing one person says one thing and the next person says the opposite, so I guess it comes down to who you want to believe.

John, you might enjoy this restoration-related thread, with regard to ID'ing restorers who have done the work, if the restorer is known, but how this info is usually not disclosed by sellers for some reason:

http://www.allposterforum.com/index.php/topic,10293.0.html


-Jeff

Offline Test1

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Re: Linen backing & biro writing?
« Reply #9 on: April 02, 2017, 02:31:00 PM »
John, you might enjoy this restoration-related thread, with regard to ID'ing restorers who have done the work, if the restorer is known, but how this info is usually not disclosed by sellers for some reason:

http://www.allposterforum.com/index.php/topic,10293.0.html

I'll take a look at that, cheers! Jeff. :)