All Poster Forum
Common Poster Subjects => Valuation => Topic started by: eatbrie on June 09, 2010, 03:13:20 AM
-
Someone was asking me the other day if my collection was insured. I answered that it wasn't and that I had no idea what it was worth anyway (nor did I really care, to be honest). But as I am quickly approaching 5,000 pieces, I'm beginning to wonder if I shouldn't. Have any of you guys dealt with this before? Everything else I own is insured, house, furniture, fine art, but posters... I draw a blank.
T
-
My collection is no where near yours .. But Ive been asked that as well .. Outside of saving all of my receipts, I dont know of any way to "value" something of this nature .. and that might not reflect actual "market" value .. (you may have gotten a deal or just really wanted a piece and was willing to over pay)
If you do look further into this please keep us posted, Im very curious as well !
-
You can insure for replacement value, here is what I was quoted about a year ago. This was from a collectibles insurance firm. I was quoted as a dealer thinking it would be cheaper, which is probably ass backwards of what I should have done in hindsight.
Coverage Level (All locations)| Term| Transit Coverage| USPS Mail Coverage| Premium (including taxes)| Policy Fee (if applicable)| Total
100,000 |6 months |Full |No |$824.00| $55.00 |$879.00
sooooo, basically 9.00 for every 1000 of coverage per 6 months.
Cost really doesnt seem that bad, but I could not bring myself to insure this stuff when it costs more to insure than my house and vehicle combined.
-
www.collectinsure.com
Collectibles Insurance Company
Good Firm
-
Doesn't general household insurance cover ALL interior possessions? I have a $20,000 apartment policy, which costs $150 a year and which I'm assuming covers my poster collection and frames. I'll have to actually read my policy (bleh).
And here's something interesting. The United States temporarily has NO ESTATE TAX. So now is the time to "kick the bucket" if you want to enrich your heirs:
Legacy for One Billionaire: Death, but No Taxes (http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/09/business/09estate.html)
-
And here's something interesting. The United States temporarily has NO ESTATE TAX. So now is the time to "kick the bucket" if you want to enrich your heirs:
Yeah, but it won't last long. It is about to be changed to a Hefty 55% tax. Government policy has to pay for all the Spending between the last two Presidencies.
Also you better read you insurance policy. Most of the time they are going to want you to have receipts or something showing what you bought these items. If you can keep them online that would be good. Also, most insurance companies will make you get them appraised after a certain point. A lot of times it is due to the amount of money involved and when you are talking about a lot of a certain item then it becomes a collection which you will need additional insurance or even a different coverage by another company. When you read your policy make sure you go over these main sections:
LOSSES INSURED
LOSSES NOT INSURED
CONDITIONS
ADDITIONAL COVERAGES
EXCLUSIONS
Many home owners policies have caps. They may cover you on personal property, which is usually found under coverage B, up to a percentage of your coverage on the house but there are limits depending on the situation. Say you have a 150,000 limit on personal property. Well it depends on what happened and where. Some coverage can be found off property and some can't. Say jewelry got stolen on property. It might be covered up to $500 or $1,000 as a standard policy limit anything more you better have bought another policy or paid for additional coverage on the particular limit.
You also need to make sure you know what kind of loss we are talking about. A Fire Loss, which includes most storm related damage is standard with your typical home owners policy.
***Be Informed*** That the majority of people in the US do not have a Flood Policy. If your house gets flooded you are responsible in most cases. This is the biggest misconception in the insurance business. Many people think just because they bought the BEST policy offered by a typical insurance company they are covered on everything. ThAT IS NOT THE CASE. Most Flood policies can be bought separate usually by the government and it depends on the area you live in. Next to the ocean or a large river that has overflowed in the past. But even these flood policies are very very limited. Also, you have to have the area you live in to be declared flooded. So this means that if you house floods due to heavy rains - No coverage found. You have to have an area flooded like a block which will include your neighbors house.
If you do have coverage of flooding on your standard home owners policy it is not really under flooding. It is usually under a Sewer and Backup Extension on the policy. But the insurance adjuster has to prove that this did happen by two things. One you have a sump pump that fails due power outage and two you have a drain in the floor in some spot that water could have backed up though.
Now keep in mind this is different from flood damage due to storm damage first. That is covered under the Fire policy and it usually Top Down. Where as the scenarios I mentioned above with flooding are Ground Up. Top Down coverage comes from wind damage which blows siding off or your roof off and then heavy rain water comes down in and damaged insulation, ceilings, walls, and what is on the walls (Framed Posters). Now the structure is covered under Coverage A but pictures, posters, TV's, and anything else that can be considered hanging on the wall or next the water will be covered under Coverage B portion of the policy. Personal Property is usually considered anything that can be picked up and taken away from the house in the event of a homeowner moving. If not then it is part of the structure of the house and is covered under Coverage A which is almost always higher than the limit under Coverage B.
Sorry for being a bit lengthy but hopefully this was informative to many people who took the time to read it. If you have any questions call your insurance company to have them clarify the policy language and don't be alarmed if your agent can't give you a direct answer. One, usually they don't know and two, it is usually not in their best interest to interpret the policy due to possible lawsuits.
Chad
-
Well over here in the U.K. back when I relised I was paying quite a bit for posters. I thought I had better look in to it, as I had several thousand posters myself. I was told by a couple of insurance companys that I would have to have an independant valuation done at my expence, which would have to be up dated each year (at my expence again). The premium to be paid would be based on the final valuation and type of cover required.
Needless to say I never got this done as the cost of a valuation, and then the actual insurance would be out of my price range.
-
List every item, forget what you paid, its what they are worth when lost/stolen/damaged. if you have a list get a dealer friend to (and pay them) value the collection on their letter head, we do it all the time for coins. But they may/probably will have to state they SAW the items.
-
The question of value and insurance was recently brought up and discussed on MOPO. A member's collection, which he had stored away from his home, literally went up in flames, when an adjacent business caught fire and was completely destroyed, as well. Per his post:
"I lost 6000 square feet of items and 6 large semi trailers full of collectibles, etc. I had over 2000 movie posters in the building as well as other movie memorabilia. Other items were antiques, autographs, 80,000 books, 40,000 vinyl records, sports memorabilia, etc. Since I didn't have insurance, my only hope is a lawsuit against the building liability since they had the fire sprinklers shut off. I did have some of my better posters out for a show and some in another truck."
A truly monumental loss. All that being said, have more collectors here on APF added / checked with their policies to make sure they are covered for loss or damage to their poster collections? Or even tried to determine a value of their collections in the event that something like this happened?
-
this is how I value my collection
(http://www.comic-art.com/temp/apf/goldbars.jpg)
here is how my ex-wife valued my collection
(http://www.comic-art.com/temp/apf/pile_of_shit.jpg)
-
As Ari says, I have, (very out of date now) a list of what I actually own.
I've nominated a dollar amount on my home contents insurance of what it would cost to replace them, not what I paid.
I just update this figure every year to cover any significant additions.
-
I've nominated a dollar amount on my home contents insurance of what it would cost to replace them, not what I paid.
How much for the crappy A&C meet the invisible man? :)
-
How much for the crappy A&C meet the invisible man? :)
1,000,000.00. It was hard to place a value on that one, that's for sure ;)
-
Thanks for sharing that story, Jeff. Very sad to hear that guy lost all that stuff, and him not having insurance for it. Terrible.
-
Rich, excellent choice of pics to make sense of things. laugh1
-
Doesn't general household insurance cover ALL interior possessions? I have a $20,000 apartment policy, which costs $150 a year and which I'm assuming covers my poster collection and frames. I'll have to actually read my policy (bleh).
I'd agree with that. I checked with my agent when we moved state and they said it was covered under 'home and contents' unless I wanted to specifically nominate individual items for insurance if they are over a certain value, can't remember what value but it's like jewelery, unless it is really valuable then it's covered - just have to define the value of 'really valuable'.
Also as most in this forum here do - keep a record of them away from your property (eg website/photobucket).
As an aside: $20K contents insurance? Sounds very light, sure that is correct? Have a look in your wardrobe, add up the replacement value of your biz shirts, suits, shoes and other clothing, easily $5K, plus the value of your linen and manchester. sheets, pillow cases, duvet and cover x two (most people have spare!) plus a King size bed - there's another $5K. Suddenly it adds up and we haven't even done the really important things: TV and Stereo. Under insuring personal effects is a heart and wallet breaker
-
As an aside: $20K contents insurance? Sounds very light, sure that is correct? Have a look in your wardrobe, add up the replacement value of your biz shirts, suits, shoes and other clothing, easily $5K, plus the value of your linen and manchester. sheets, pillow cases, duvet and cover x two (most people have spare!) plus a King size bed - there's another $5K. Suddenly it adds up and we haven't even done the really important things: TV and Stereo. Under insuring personal effects is a heart and wallet breaker
I know I am scruffy, but if I have a thousand bucks invested in clothes and bedding, then I'll cry.
Apart from books and posters and various collected things, all my real life stuff went with my marriage. Feels kinda free (just the junk holds me back).
-
I know I am scruffy, but if I have a thousand bucks invested in clothes and bedding, then I'll cry.
Apart from books and posters and various collected things, all my real life stuff went with my marriage. Feels kinda free (just the junk holds me back).
You have to count that machete you keep on your nightstand as part of the bedding...
-
in that case, I AM RICH! (actually it cost $5 from Chinatown ;) but its worth a lot to me.
-
I have a $20,000 apartment policy, which costs $150 a year and which I'm assuming covers my poster collection and frames.
If I do my maths, for 1000 posters that's $20 a poster. Factor in other house contents and the posters then come down to about 1 cent each. I reckon Mel is being realistic. ;) I do like Go Ape
-
I have my collection as a named item within the Household insurance.
There were a few companies that didn't cover it, most notably Lloyds Gold service top of the range thing which wouldn't entertain it no matter what I did or how I valued it. That said, another company had no problem with it.
As for listing, it is all on a spreadsheet with rough figures assigned based on rough ebay guess-timates.
-
If I do my maths, for 1000 posters that's $20 a poster. Factor in other house contents and the posters then come down to about 1 cent each. I reckon Mel is being realistic. ;) I do like Go Ape
But Steve, Gigi tells me my insurance policy is just right....
(http://posternirvana.com/0DNE/Gigi.jpg)
-
this is how I value my collection
(http://www.comic-art.com/temp/apf/goldbars.jpg)
here is how my ex-wife valued my collection
(http://www.comic-art.com/temp/apf/pile_of_shit.jpg)
I would think that during the divorce and asset split agreement that it would have been exactly the opposite. :)
-
But as I am quickly approaching 5,000 pieces...
Wow, my opening post was in June 2010. 19 months later, I'm approaching 7,000 pieces. I need to find myself a new hobby :)
PS: I had a big party at the house last Saturday. I told one of the guests that I was collecting movies posters. He looked around and couldn't see any, Just Laura in the hallway. He was a little bit baffled. Then I took him to my office adjacent to the garage. He still couldn't see the posters. Then he notices the drawers flushed to the wall... and got it :) It helps to be OCD.
T
-
Wow, my opening post was in June 2010. 19 months later, I'm approaching 7,000 pieces. I need to find myself a new hobby :)
PS: I had a big party at the house last Saturday. I told one of the guests that I was collecting movies posters. He looked around and couldn't see any, Just Laura in the hallway. He was a little bit baffled. Then I took him to my office adjacent to the garage. He still couldn't see the posters. Then he notices the drawers flushed to the wall... and got it :) It helps to be OCD.
T
OCD I understand..I was just browsing Betamax on E-bay and was very tempted to update my Cassette collection...thankfully I backed away and closed the browser....
Stew
-
I've only really ever valued pieces never put together a sum... X is worth X and Y is worth Y so Z*X+N*Y="Yeah, I have no clue". If my house caught one fire, I'd just go back and print off every acquisition post and my website stuff...
-
It took me 10 years or so to put my collection together, and that, to me, is worth more than the price of the posters, since I can't replace time.
I also know that I wouldn't sell any of my posters, even the bad ones, for less than $1. So my collection is worth at least $7,000.
T
-
Someone was asking me the other day if my collection was insured. I answered that it wasn't and that I had no idea what it was worth anyway (nor did I really care, to be honest). But as I am quickly approaching 5,000 pieces, I'm beginning to wonder if I shouldn't. Have any of you guys dealt with this before? Everything else I own is insured, house, furniture, fine art, but posters... I draw a blank.
T
Hahaha, that's funny. I started this thread in 2010 when I owned 5,000 posters. As I'm now past 13,000 pieces, I decided it was time to insure my collection. An impossible task, really. Hard to insure something worth $5k and something worth $1 together. So I looked through my website and divided my collection into three categories, posters I know are worth more than $1,000, posters worth more than $500 and the rest. I will insure the first two categories, mainly to keep my wife quiet, and forget the rest.
How do you guys do it?
T
-
I've actually just done mine this week. We are moving house soon so getting everything in order.
There's no way I can insure each individual one so I've done exactly what you did T except on a lesser scale. Anything above £200 I have insured.
The policy I have is £100,000 contents of which the maximum £30,000 is deemed valuables (posters).
The cost was £64 for the year, a steal really and the best bit is I went through a 'special site' to get £31 cash back haha. (so £33)
Marc
-
I have about 25K of valuables so I try and keep my collection around that. Not an exact science of course. T, in this case I would listen to the wife. She is totally right and you are doing the right thing. thumbsup.gif
-
I have insurance for my fine art collection (mostly Old Master paintings and rare books), and that covers all my works on paper as well (Old Master drawings, rare maps, prints, and movie posters).
-
I have contents insurance, but started a separate policy for posters/prints a couple of years back. I have a list and photos of all the posters/prints I have and totted up a rough value, then insured it for that amount.
-
I have insurance for my fine art collection (mostly Old Master paintings and rare books), and that covers all my works on paper as well (Old Master drawings, rare maps, prints, and movie posters).
Good advices, all.
Antoine, since you're a collector of fine art, have you ever thought of loaning part or all of your collection to museums? There are a few advantages to that: 1) They pay your insurance, 2) they insure perfect humidity and lighting, 3) no fear of thieves, 4) it gets to be seen, and 5) and perhaps most importantly, a piece of art has a pedigree (where it's been, exhibits, collectors, literature) that can sometimes be more important than the art itself, and being in a museum is an added selling point should you decide to sell in the future. It's proof that your art is good enough to be exhibited. Then you can just make a perfect copy of the original, put it on your wall in the original frame and ta-da, let the thieves in ;)
T
-
Thierry, I have indeed thought of loaning my fine art collection to museums. I have a few paintings that actually used to belong to public collections (among them a 16th century Italian portrait from the Metropolitan Museum in NYC, and a 17th century allegory from the Toledo Museum of Art in Ohio), and one work that was exhibited at the Met Breuer not too long ago. I'm fully aware of the fact that having an association with a museum or public institution is a bonus for the provenance of any artwork, and therefore adds to its value. At the same time, I do like to see my paintings on the walls daily and live with them, so I'm not quite ready for a long-term loan. But it's definitely something that I'm open to at some point in the future.
-
Yes, enjoying the real thing is a must, but not fearing thieves and not paying insurance also works.
Btw, I admire your boldness in sharing your fine art collection on a public forum. You must have quite the security system ;). This is not something I could do. Movie posters are one thing, most people don't care about them, but fine art is a whole different beast.
T
-
My spreadsheet has all the current values, and then, per the insurers' demands, anything over £1k has to be specified in the inventory for their quote.
That is how it has been done, as part of the household contents. We will see if there is an argument to be had if ever there is a reason to claim...
-
I pray for no natural disasters is my insurance as I cannot afford to insure it!
-
Insurance was invented to avoid financial collapse in case of a catastrophe. So if my house burns down I need to rebuild it and have a new household. Thats why I insure both.
If my posters are destroied I would not have to replace them so I'd just loose invested money what would be sad but would not affect my family nor financial survival. That's why I do not insure the posters irrespective of their value.
-
My spreadsheet has all the current values, and then, per the insurers' demands, anything over £1k has to be specified in the inventory for their quote.
That is how it has been done, as part of the household contents. We will see if there is an argument to be had if ever there is a reason to claim...
How do you figure current values? The only hard value is what I paid for it, and generally that just means it was worth slightly less to some other fool.
I suppose one can track every sale of every poster one owns, but that would be too OCD even for me.