All Poster Forum
Movie Posters => General Discussion => Topic started by: erik1925 on June 17, 2017, 01:48:06 AM
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There has been a bit of discussion over in the Post Auction thread about the quality of the imagery, design layout etc of the poster campaigns that Universal put out for first releases of their films compared to the later poster campaigns that Realart produced when they re-released many of these classic horror films.
Rather than have that discussion get mixed into the Post auction thread, I thought I'd start a unique thread on the topic, so that various POV about both releases & later RR could be expressed.
I own only one Realart poster. It's a 3 sheet for their 1948 re-release of The Raven (1935). I'm sure the 1935 3 sheet was a sight to behold but no copies are known to exist. And from the research I've done, this RR 3sheet from 1948 is an only known copy.
In this case, though the original 1935 3sh art was likely better (and probably done in stone lithography, vs the cheaper method of tinted photographs), since no copy is known to exist, then this later example is better than none at all.
And as Benjamin and Rich both mentioned -- at the end of the day, (as with all poster imagery), it comes down to personal preference.
As a heads up to the forum, I may splinter off the related (and initial) comments made in the Post Analysis thread, and put them here, if it seems to add to the foundation of this thread.
(http://www.allposterforum.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=117.0;attach=6648;image)
C/U Detail shot of Karloff:
(http://i1355.photobucket.com/albums/q719/spitfire3992/karloffCUraven_zpsn3uhlg2n.jpg)
Vs the First Release 3 sheet (1935) - from pressbook: ;)
(http://www.allposterforum.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=12167.0;attach=6539;image)
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there probably are a few out there. I have the 1sh
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Yes... OS and inserts for the Realart '48 RR have been auctioned (or offered) via various venues in the past, including ebay. And maybe other 3sh are also floating around out there and have just not been offered for sale.
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The '48 HS...
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Thanks for creating this separate thread for this topic, Jeff. I agree that it's an interesting enough discussion to warrant its own thread.
Just to be clear, I didn't make a blanket statement about all Realart paper being inferior to the first release posters in my initial post: all I said was that I generally didn't like Realart ONE-SHEETS as much as I did the first release OS. I cited Dracula's Daughter and The Mummy as examples where the first release OS are much better than the Realart ones (at least IMO). I think that Realart inserts are sometimes quite good, as well as their lobby cards, so my opinion was based strictly on comparing OS.
Jeff, thanks for posting your own copy of The Raven RR1948-3sheet, it's interesting to look at and try to imagine what the first release 3S would have looked like (I should check out the pressbook for that movie to get an idea).
As an aside, I agree that the Dracula RR1947 OS is pretty good (although it's not Realart, therefore my initial statement still stands), and personally I really like the Dracula RR1947 3-sheet the best.
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Ben, in checking out the pb, I found that there were two styles of 3 sheet from the original Raven release.
Here are Styles B and C from the pressbook:
(http://www.allposterforum.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=12167.0;attach=6537;image) (http://www.allposterforum.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=12167.0;attach=6539;image)
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sure would like to see those in color!
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Thanks for digging those pressbook pics Jeff. That 3-S style C is gorgeous.
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The original release OS for Frankenstein in 1931 and the 1947RR OS. Both releases/posters were done by Universal, in this case.
(http://www.allposterforum.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=12167.0;attach=6549;image)
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The Invisible Man- 1933 Universal first release OS, and the 1951 Realart RR OS, with Claude Rains billed (and shown) front and slightly off center:
(http://www.allposterforum.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=12167.0;attach=6551;image)
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Werewolf of London
1935 Universal OS (first release) and the 1951 Realart RR OS poster:
(http://www.allposterforum.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=12167.0;attach=6553;image)
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Just to be clear, I didn't make a blanket statement about all Realart paper being inferior to the first release posters in my initial post: all I said was that I generally didn't like Realart ONE-SHEETS as much as I did the first release OS. I cited Dracula's Daughter and The Mummy as examples where the first release OS are much better than the Realart ones (at least IMO). I think that Realart inserts are sometimes quite good, as well as their lobby cards, so my opinion was based strictly on comparing OS.
While it's usually not fair to compare the work of Karoly Grosz to other one-sheets, it's especially not fair in the case of the Mummy, which is considered one of the most beautiful posters ever.
Dracula's Daughter, I'm not a fan of either of the one-sheets and feel the inserts (both Universal and Realart) are the best paper for the respective releases.
Thanks to wikipedia for this cool comparison of the Dracula one-sheets, but I stand by my statement that the 47 poster is the best, the Realart is a crude copy of the original style B and the 60s release poster is probably the second best Dracula poster.
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/73/Dracula_one_sheet_movie_posters.jpeg/880px-Dracula_one_sheet_movie_posters.jpeg)
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While it's usually not fair to compare the work of Karoly Grosz to other one-sheets, it's especially not fair in the case of the Mummy, which is considered one of the most beautiful posters ever.
Dracula's Daughter, I'm not a fan of either of the one-sheets and feel the inserts (both Universal and Realart) are the best paper for the respective releases.
Thanks to wikipedia for this cool comparison of the Dracula one-sheets, but I stand by my statement that the 47 poster is the best, the Realart is a crude copy of the original style B and the 60s release poster is probably the second best Dracula poster.
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/73/Dracula_one_sheet_movie_posters.jpeg/880px-Dracula_one_sheet_movie_posters.jpeg)
honestly, I like all of them equally except for the 1938. But I would really still like to get the 1961 poster.
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Three 3-sheets for Frankenstein (1931). Both later RR were also done by Universal in 1938 and 1947. The '47 image is from the pressbook.
(The original, 1931 3 sheet sold via Heritage, back in March of 2015, for $300,000.00 plus the added BP, totaling $358,500.00) thumbsup.gif
(http://www.allposterforum.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=12167.0;attach=6559;image)
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Thanks Crowzilla for posting these comparisons. Personally, my favorite Dracula OS is the first release style F, but I understand those who prefer the 1947 version. As I said before, my favorite RR poster for Dracula is the 1947 3-sheet.
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Antoine, I think if I were to pick one of the 31 styles it would be the F also - which remarkably is the most common of the Dracula posters with 5 known copies (3 in one find in the 90s, and 2 in one find a few years ago).
While that still makes them incredibly tough, compare that to the time period through the late 80s when it was assumed that just the one copy of the style B had survived. Then an A was found, then the other style B which had been found with the first copy resurfaced, than the 3 style Fs, than the C, then the single copy of the 38 one-sheet surfaced in 2003, then the most recent Fs.
It's no wonder early collectors thought these were the rarest of the rare, as these copies just weren't known to exist back then.
When I purchased the Hill copy of the 47 Dracula over a decade ago he told me he paid $500 for it in the early 70s and didn't hesitate as at that time no 31 one-sheet was even known to exist yet. Back then it was the most expensive re-release poster known, and I believe it is probably still the most valuable re-release one-sheet from any title.
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Thank you Crowzilla for this detailed history of the various Dracula posters, it's fascinating.
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Antoine, I think if I were to pick one of the 31 styles it would be the F also - which remarkably is the most common of the Dracula posters with 5 known copies (3 in one find in the 90s, and 2 in one find a few years ago).
While that still makes them incredibly tough, compare that to the time period through the late 80s when it was assumed that just the one copy of the style B had survived. Then an A was found, then the other style B which had been found with the first copy resurfaced, than the 3 style Fs, than the C, then the single copy of the 38 one-sheet surfaced in 2003, then the most recent Fs.
It's no wonder early collectors thought these were the rarest of the rare, as these copies just weren't known to exist back then.
When I purchased the Hill copy of the 47 Dracula over a decade ago he told me he paid $500 for it in the early 70s and didn't hesitate as at that time no 31 one-sheet was even known to exist yet. Back then it was the most expensive re-release poster known, and I believe it is probably still the most valuable re-release one-sheet from any title.
Likey.jpg
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Antoine, I think if I were to pick one of the 31 styles it would be the F also - which remarkably is the most common of the Dracula posters with 5 known copies (3 in one find in the 90s, and 2 in one find a few years ago).
While that still makes them incredibly tough, compare that to the time period through the late 80s when it was assumed that just the one copy of the style B had survived. Then an A was found, then the other style B which had been found with the first copy resurfaced, than the 3 style Fs, than the C, then the single copy of the 38 one-sheet surfaced in 2003, then the most recent Fs.
It's no wonder early collectors thought these were the rarest of the rare, as these copies just weren't known to exist back then.
When I purchased the Hill copy of the 47 Dracula over a decade ago he told me he paid $500 for it in the early 70s and didn't hesitate as at that time no 31 one-sheet was even known to exist yet. Back then it was the most expensive re-release poster known, and I believe it is probably still the most valuable re-release one-sheet from any title.
Love reading info like this, thanks Sean
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Sean,
Do you know how many known copies there are of each style of the Dracula posters?
Marc
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The Wolf Man (1941) US Insert:
(http://www.allposterforum.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=12167.0;attach=6618;image)
1948 Realart RR Insert:
(http://www.allposterforum.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=12167.0;attach=6622;image)
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Sean,
Do you know how many known copies there are of each style of the Dracula posters?
Yes.
1931
A - 1 copy
B - 2 copies
C - 1 copy
F - 5 copies
half sheet - 1 of each style
insert - 4 copies
1938 1-sheet - 1 copy
1947 1-sheet - I believe 9 copies
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The Wolf Man (1941) US Insert:
(http://www.allposterforum.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=12167.0;attach=6618;image)
1948 Realart RR Insert:
(http://www.allposterforum.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=12167.0;attach=6622;image)
Seems by the time 1948 rolled around, Realart decided to put a shirt on Lon.
And a little factoid I found. When the movie went into production, its original, working title was Destiny. As mentioned in this newspaper clip from The Evening Independent.
(http://www.allposterforum.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=12167.0;attach=7729;image)
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Yes.
1931
A - 1 copy
B - 2 copies
C - 1 copy
F - 5 copies
half sheet - 1 of each style
insert - 4 copies
1938 1-sheet - 1 copy
1947 1-sheet - I believe 9 copies
so I guess the new tally is A - 1 copy 2 copies
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so I guess the new tally is A - 1 copy 2 copies
Yep. thumbsup.gif
30 years ago, 1 total 31 Dracula one-sheet accounted for, today 9 total copies.
Amazing.
five of them have been up for public auction (3 copies of the style F, one of the style B and now one of the style A), the other four have also each sold one time since they surfaced and are still with the original buyers (one since the 70s, the others since the 90s).
These posters do not trade hands very often
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Yep. thumbsup.gif
30 years ago, 1 total 31 Dracula one-sheet accounted for, today 9 total copies.
Amazing.
five of them have been up for public auction (3 copies of the style F, one of the style B and now one of the style A), the other four have also each sold one time since they surfaced and are still with the original buyers (one since the 70s, the others since the 90s).
These posters do not trade hands very often
what else is out there.. inquiring minds want to know.....
also, the inquiring mind wants to be the 'finder'
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what else is out there.. inquiring minds want to know.....
also, the inquiring mind wants to be the 'finder'
How amazing would it be to be a finder of an as yet unknown or undiscovered copy (of any) of the original release Uni horror titles. Every time I wander in to some little second hand shop or store and look thru folded materials, I think, "What if.....?"
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How amazing would it be to be a finder of an as yet unknown or undiscovered copy (of any) of the original release Uni horror titles. Every time I wander in to some little second hand shop or store and look thru folded materials, I think, "What if.....?"
screw that crap, I want to find a tall stack of boxes of posters from a first run theatre that was only open from 1915-1945!
;D
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Yeah, wouldn't that be amazing (http://www.allposterforum.com/index.php/topic,3277.0.html) :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(
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screw that crap, I want to find a tall stack of boxes of posters from a first run theatre that was only open from 1915-1945!
;D
At least my pipe dream seems a hair more realistic! qip starz.gif
(or maybe not)
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I want to find an abandoned warehouse that was owned by Morgan Litho
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I want to find an abandoned warehouse that was owned by Morgan Litho
They were located about 20 miles from where I was raised, in CLE, OH.
So maybe the next time I'm there.......
I actually wonder what that property is being used for now? How cool would THAT be, were it still sitting, closed, waiting for some kind of re-use or refurb, with a back storage area, filled with posters from back in its heyday. faint2.gif
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screw that crap, I want to find a tall stack of boxes of posters from a first run theatre that was only open from 1915-1945!
;D
bed1
Awkward boner moment.
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lol
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The Invisible Ray (1936)
First release OS and the 1948 Realart RR OS:
(http://www.allposterforum.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=12167.0;attach=7897;image)
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House of Dracula (1945) and the 1950 RR onesheets, with Realart going with actual photos along with an image of the monster strapped to the operating table:
(http://www.allposterforum.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=12167.0;attach=8175;image)
(http://www.allposterforum.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=12167.0;attach=8177;image)
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Son of Dracula (1943) -- and the 1948 Realart RR
(https://i.imgur.com/A5CjYKG.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/A3F3ajR.jpg)
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Son of Dracula (1943) -- and the 1948 Realart RR
(https://i.imgur.com/A5CjYKG.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/A3F3ajR.jpg)
Hi Jeff, The old more or less green skin question, eh?! I like the more dramatic angle and larger image on the Realart poster. Okie
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For sure, okie.
I guess that day-glo, yellow-green was out of vogue by 1948, and they decided for the all natural look on Chaney.
And I agree, that the shift in angles works much better on the RR poster, too. Makes for more of a menacing feel. >:D
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The Mummy (1932); 3 sheets from the first release and the 1951 Realart re-release
(https://i.imgur.com/G1Jnqej.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/GoB2k0I.png)
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The Mummy (1932); 3 sheets from the first release and the 1951 Realart re-release
(https://i.imgur.com/G1Jnqej.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/GoB2k0I.png)
I like both versions, Jeff. Who doesn't like a nice Karloff image and you get two flavors with these two posters. I'm partial to a nice large image of Zita like on the 1951 as well as the original one sheet. Christopher Walken might say, "I've got a fever baby, and the only cure is more Zita!" Okie
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I like both versions, Jeff. Who doesn't like a nice Karloff image and you get two flavors with these two posters. I'm partial to a nice large image of Zita like on the 1951 as well as the original one sheet. Christopher Walken might say, "I've got a fever baby, and the only cure is more Zita!" Okie
I agree with you, okie. Both versions sure have something to offer. The great, large image of Karloff on the RR is amazing, too, as well as showing Johann dressed in her Egyptian costume.
And, of course, the incredible, super-rich and vibrant stone litho art on the first release is knock over gorgeous, without a doubt. Those colors and detail just pull you in. notworthy.gif
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The Mummy's Tomb (1942)
First release US OS:
(https://i.imgur.com/sT5e1TR.jpg)
And the 1948 Realart re-release OS:
(https://i.imgur.com/n82cUhN.jpg)
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Hi Jeff, Is the rerelease for The Mummy's Tomb print registration out of alignment a bit? It seems blurry. I like the rerelease design better. Okie
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Hi Jeff, Is the rerelease for The Mummy's Tomb print registration out of alignment a bit? It seems blurry. I like the rerelease design better. Okie
Hi Okie.. Here;s another Realart RR OS image from HA. Looks pretty similar to the one up above, registration-wise, dont you think?
(https://i.imgur.com/T4HJrcJ.jpg)
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Hi Jeff, Yes, they both look a little blurry. I think the print registration is off slightly. Good job finding two images. Okie
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Hi Jeff, Yes, they both look a little blurry. I think the print registration is off slightly. Good job finding two images. Okie
Here a much larger image of the HA copy, Okie ;) Click on the image for supersize.
(https://i.imgur.com/Q05qqS2.jpg)
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Thanks, Jeff. Is there such a thing as dirty/smudgy looking printing?! Okie
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Thanks, Jeff. Is there such a thing as dirty/smudgy looking printing?! Okie
Maybe, Okie. I dont know.
But if you zoom in on the supersize image, you can see that things like the various fonts used, and the headstone are all crystal sharp. Maybe when Realart enlarged the artwork of the Mummy and girl, it made it look more fuzzy? The image of Turhan Bey that was used also looks "muddy," so I see what you mean, there, too.
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MAN-MADE MONSTER (1941) along with the re-titled 1953 RR, THE ATOMIC MONSTER
(http://i1355.photobucket.com/albums/q719/spitfire3992/MMM_zpsc3ff6985.jpg~original)
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US one sheets for MURDERS IN THE RUE MORGUE (1932) & the Realart 1948 RR.
(https://i.imgur.com/MJYkPNh.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/OZ7cnhB.jpg)
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Nice condition 1-sheet on the RUE MORGUE reissue but the graphics suck! Did Universal think so little of Bela that they didn't bother to put even a small picture of him on the poster? At least it's got belly dancers! :P
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Nice condition 1-sheet on the RUE MORGUE reissue but the graphics suck! Did Universal think so little of Bela that they didn't bother to put even a small picture of him on the poster? At least it's got belly dancers! :P
I noticed that same, missing Bela, too, cabman. I dont get it.
But maybe because it was Realart doing the re-release and not UNI, they must have thought that a poster with the gorilla and belly dancers alone would be enough of a draw,even with the main man himself left out. :-\
But even a smaller pic somewhere on the poster of BL should have been used... Im so with you on that, too.
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Hard to beat the original Rue one sheet. I do like the reissue three sheet, even without Lugosi. Okie
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I don't have many Unihorror pieces, because it wasn't entirely my collecting wheelhouse, I do however have the House of Dracula 1950R and it is definitely better than the original.
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Hard to beat the original Rue one sheet. I do like the reissue three sheet, even without Lugosi. Okie
Ive not seen the RR 3 sheet for RUE MORGUE, Okie. Is the artwork the same (or similar) to that of the OS posted above?
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Ive not seen the RR 3 sheet for RUE MORGUE, Okie. Is the artwork the same (or similar) to that of the OS posted above?
Looks very nearly the same except the title is placed over Sidney and the dancing girls at the bottom
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Ive not seen the RR 3 sheet for RUE MORGUE, Okie. Is the artwork the same (or similar) to that of the OS posted above?
Here is the Rue 3 sheet rerelease from 1948. I think it looks better than the '48 one sheet, even with the similar image. The 3 sheet color scheme, lettering/title design, and position of the simian all work better in my eye. Okie
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Im with you on the better looking arrangement of the imagery on the 3sh, too, Okie.
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FRANKENSTEIN MEETS THE WOLF MAN (1943)
(https://i.imgur.com/EGbGc1N.jpg)
And the re-drawn 1949 Realart RR, featuring Bela's stunt double, Eddie Parker, lower front and center-ish, carrying Ilona Massey. ;)
(https://i.imgur.com/cLX90Hu.jpg)
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The out of proportion arms etc. on the paper for Frank meets Wolf always bugged me. Though, are monsters really out of proportion ever? Okie
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Realart 1/2 sht Son/Bride of Frankenstein. I have this poster and like the Monster's image, though the bright yellows do not scream ominous enough to me. Okie
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Agree with you on the yellow background, Okie - it's a color that hardly conveys horror or terror.
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Agree with you on the yellow background, Okie - it's a color that hardly conveys horror or terror.
Jeff, Do you think it's supposed to be "pee your pants" yellow? Okie