All Poster Forum
Common Poster Subjects => Packaging & Shipping => Topic started by: pratschm on August 10, 2016, 08:30:06 AM
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This is unbelievable. I recently won an auction on UK ebay which would ship via their Global Shipping Program (GSP). I paid promptly and the seller sent the item to the shipping center, run by Pitney Bowes. Two days later I receive multiple emails from ebay stating that the item cannot be forwarded due to being oversized. The seller then proceeds to contact ebay to find out what is going on and is told that Pitney Bowes WILL BE KEEPING THE ITEM!!! Are you fucking kidding me?!?!!! What the hell kind of shit is that?!?!!! In case you can't tell I'm extremely pissed off about this.
Moral of the story: don't EVER use GSP. And fuck gun1 ebay gun2.
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That sucks. I never buy from GSP and make a point of telling whatever seller why I won't be bidding. Often they don't even realize that GSP is on their listing (like its set up as the default gotta "opt out") and relist the item for me without GSP.
I would open a paypal claim as soon as possible!
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Yup - have had similar issues Nothing like the above story, mind.
But I tell the seller I want nothing to do with GSP. And that they should consider alternate means of shipping or I won't be bidding.
It does screw over both sellers and buyers, and you're right, sometimes the sellers aren't even aware this is what they have opted for on their detail.
Good luck.
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The seller then proceeds to contact ebay to find out what is going on and is told that Pitney Bowes WILL BE KEEPING THE ITEM!!!
I've never heard of such nonsense.
Please keep us updated, Mike.
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From the seller's live chat with an ebay rep:
"I've checked the global tracking number on this item and I can confirmed that it has 'Undeliverable - Order exceeds size limit'. I can see that the items are generally liquidated if they are oversized, overweight, or a system restriction has occurred (i.e. item won’t clear customs). At which point the item is owned by Pitney Bowes (logistics company) and will not be return to you"
Old link, but similiar situation:
http://community.ebay.com/t5/Archive-Shipping-Returns/Global-Shipping-Program-is-a-Pitney-Bowes-Scam/td-p/19706295 (http://community.ebay.com/t5/Archive-Shipping-Returns/Global-Shipping-Program-is-a-Pitney-Bowes-Scam/td-p/19706295)
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Fuck you, Pitney Bowes.
(http://i.imgur.com/hHDqx.gif)
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From the seller's live chat with an ebay rep:
"I've checked the global tracking number on this item and I can confirmed that it has 'Undeliverable - Order exceeds size limit'. I can see that the items are generally liquidated if they are oversized, overweight, or a system restriction has occurred (i.e. item won’t clear customs). At which point the item is owned by Pitney Bowes (logistics company) and will not be return to you"
Old link, but similiar situation:
http://community.ebay.com/t5/Archive-Shipping-Returns/Global-Shipping-Program-is-a-Pitney-Bowes-Scam/td-p/19706295 (http://community.ebay.com/t5/Archive-Shipping-Returns/Global-Shipping-Program-is-a-Pitney-Bowes-Scam/td-p/19706295)
I truly dont get it, Mike. How is PB able to keep something that you (or anyone) has paid for? What goves them that right? Will you be getting in touch with PB directly?
And will the transaction be canceled with you getting a FULL refund? Man, I hope so.
Totally a sucky situation, all the way around. Nothing like learning about some ultra fine print restriction AFTER the deal and sale has been made. eyeroll
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So lame they sell it for profit rather than make the buyer or give them an option to have it returned to the original shipping address.
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Emphasis below is mine.
http://pages.ebay.com/shipping/globalshipping/buyer-tnc.html
Section 11
Lost, Damaged, or Undeliverable Items; Valid Delivery Address Required. If a GSP Item that you purchase is not delivered to the delivery address specified by you or to the collection center near you that is designated by the shipping carrier, it is damaged, or it does not match your Seller's description, your purchase may be covered by an eBay Money Back Guarantee or PayPal Purchase Protection program. More information about eBay Money Back Guarantee and PayPal Purchase Protection may be found here and here. The delivery address that you specify must be within an eligible country and must be a valid and complete delivery address. The delivery address that you specify may not be a Post Office (P.O. Box), Army Post Office, or Fleet Post Office. eBay and Pitney Bowes shall have no liability and shall have, in their discretion and in any manner that they prefer, the right to dispose of or liquidate GSP Items that eBay or Pitney Bowes conclude are undeliverable, for whatever reason. If eBay or Pitney Bowes conclude that a GSP Item is undeliverable and elect to dispose of or liquidate a GSP Item, title to the GSP Item shall transfer automatically from your Seller to eBay and/or any third party designated by either eBay or Pitney Bowes (as eBay and Pitney Bowes may elect), at no cost and for no consideration to either eBay or Pitney Bowes and/or to any third party designated by eBay or Pitney Bowes, and eBay and Pitney Bowes and/or any third party designated by eBay or Pitney Bowes shall retain all proceeds (if any) received from the disposal or liquidation of the GSP Item. eBay or Pitney Bowes may also elect to return to your Seller any GSP Items that eBay or Pitney Bowes conclude are undeliverable. eBay shall not be responsible under either the eBay Money Back Guarantee or PayPal Purchase Protection policies if eBay concludes that a GSP Item is not deliverable to your designated delivery address or to the collection center near you that is designated by the shipping carrier, for any reason, including because the delivery address that you provide is incorrect, incomplete, or inaccessible. In addition, certain third party shipping carriers may require that the designated recipient of a GSP Item be present to receive delivery; where in-person delivery is required, you shall be solely responsible for ensuring that the designated recipient is available to receive delivery.
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Flabbergasted to read that. faint2.gif
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You and me both.
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Holy crap, that is indefensible. I don't expect eBay and friends to be paragons of virtue but the shameless douchebaggery is truly astounding/criminal.
And doesn't one generally enter shipping weight and dimensions when creating a listing anyway? Seems like it would be easy to make any shipping restrictions clear up front rather than this surprise mafia-like thievery after the fact.
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For future reference, just in case (this works, just used the phone number):
For Pitney Bowes customer service regarding GSP issues, you can email PBISGSPCS@pb.com to reach the GSP Customer Service group. Or you can call 1-866-235-9627, and press 1 to reach the same GSP Customer Service group. Hours of operation: Monday – Sunday, 6:00am – 11:00pm Mountain Time. (?)
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Thanks for the update and pertinent info, Mike!
Sorry that the bastards clipped you.
cheers
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Emphasis below is mine.
http://pages.ebay.com/shipping/globalshipping/buyer-tnc.html
Section 11
Lost, Damaged, or Undeliverable Items; Valid Delivery Address Required. If a GSP Item that you purchase is not delivered to the delivery address specified by you or to the collection center near you that is designated by the shipping carrier, it is damaged, or it does not match your Seller's description, your purchase may be covered by an eBay Money Back Guarantee or PayPal Purchase Protection program. More information about eBay Money Back Guarantee and PayPal Purchase Protection may be found here and here. The delivery address that you specify must be within an eligible country and must be a valid and complete delivery address. The delivery address that you specify may not be a Post Office (P.O. Box), Army Post Office, or Fleet Post Office. eBay and Pitney Bowes shall have no liability and shall have, in their discretion and in any manner that they prefer, the right to dispose of or liquidate GSP Items that eBay or Pitney Bowes conclude are undeliverable, for whatever reason. If eBay or Pitney Bowes conclude that a GSP Item is undeliverable and elect to dispose of or liquidate a GSP Item, title to the GSP Item shall transfer automatically from your Seller to eBay and/or any third party designated by either eBay or Pitney Bowes (as eBay and Pitney Bowes may elect), at no cost and for no consideration to either eBay or Pitney Bowes and/or to any third party designated by eBay or Pitney Bowes, and eBay and Pitney Bowes and/or any third party designated by eBay or Pitney Bowes shall retain all proceeds (if any) received from the disposal or liquidation of the GSP Item. eBay or Pitney Bowes may also elect to return to your Seller any GSP Items that eBay or Pitney Bowes conclude are undeliverable. eBay shall not be responsible under either the eBay Money Back Guarantee or PayPal Purchase Protection policies if eBay concludes that a GSP Item is not deliverable to your designated delivery address or to the collection center near you that is designated by the shipping carrier, for any reason, including because the delivery address that you provide is incorrect, incomplete, or inaccessible. In addition, certain third party shipping carriers may require that the designated recipient of a GSP Item be present to receive delivery; where in-person delivery is required, you shall be solely responsible for ensuring that the designated recipient is available to receive delivery.
You would think with all this fine print about what ebay or PB "concludes to be undeliverable" there would also be, elsewhere in this info, a chart, giving maximum weights or dimensions, so that sellers could determine if the parcel they were about to send, fulfilled the guidelines.
The above paragraph, with any details is beyond vague. Upon what facts are the 2 companies determining that something is deemed "undeliverable?" Let alone that they can then "liquidate" at their discretion. This is Totally Outrageous and it comes off as sounding like some total rip off or scam.
I hope you get some resolve, Mike. Or is this basically now an open and shut case, in their POV?
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Mike just open a paypal claim... you'll get your money back i'm sure.
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Thank you all for the support. Don't get me wrong, I know this is one of those silly 'first-world' types of problems, it just floored me to learn that a company could simply acquire ones property seemingly at a whim. Who ever reads the fine print of anything?
I hope you get some resolve, Mike. Or is this basically now an open and shut case, in their POV?
I called PB at lunch today and they opened a ticket for the item. I was told that they can't return the item to the seller without ebay's authorization. She almost made it sound like it might not even be in PB's possession anymore, as ebay 'confiscates' items to either dispose of or liquidate them. I asked what caused the item to be declared oversize and it sounds like the box might be 1 inch too long. ONE F-ING INCH!!! And that's probably not even the box, but more a bulge at the end of the box. I stressed multiple times that I want the item returned to the seller for alternate shipping and also that the seller has used GSP to send these items in the past without issue, all of which should be in the ticket. I'm hoping that will get the item returned, since it sounds like it is possible to have that happen, it just depends on how good a day the person that reads the email is having (or other randomization). I just hope this doesn't turn into 'well ebay says PB has to' or 'PB says ebay has to'...
Mike just open a paypal claim... you'll get your money back i'm sure.
Come now, you know I don't want the money, but rather the item. bed1
In fact, I was simply issued a (partial) refund without even knowing there was a problem. I got a PP email stating 'my case was resolved - here's your refund' and then later received a couple messages from ebay stating the item was oversized and wouldn't be forwarded. Yes, a partial refund; I still have to file a claim to get my GSP payment back. Ironic, no?
Anyways, thanks again for joining me on this journey. I'll keep you posted as the shit keeps hitting the fan.
PS - Apologies for the strong language. That's not typically my style.
PPS - TED!!!!!!! Great to hear from you! :D
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Hey Mike.. this might be a silly question but was this item a rolled poster? Or something else?
Just curious.. what was the size/dimensions of the box? I'd love to know what ebay and PB considered "oversize & therefore, undeliverable." :-\
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It was a typical 5'x8' banner. I don't know the actual dimensions, but in the past they're usually, say, 6"x6"x60" or so. Definitely not a simple standard poster tube.
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Thanks, and good to know, Mike.
And now the $million question. What movie was it for? Do you have a pic of it, by any chance?
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The irony of the situation will be that if PB are able to 'return' an item to the seller, then it should just as equally be able to 'send' it to the buyer.
And in the internet world of online shopping and delivery, what is the f--king use of any delivery system that can't deliver anything and everything?
There, some bad language of my own even though I have no investment in this discussion...
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Thanks, and good to know, Mike.
And now the $million question. What movie was it for? Do you have a pic of it, by any chance?
Don't want to say just yet, as I may need to find another, but some around here might call it 'modern crap'. ;)
The irony of the situation will be that if PB are able to 'return' an item to the seller, then it should just as equally be able to 'send' it to the buyer.
And in the internet world of online shopping and delivery, what is the f--king use of any delivery system that can't deliver anything and everything?
There, some bad language of my own even though I have no investment in this discussion...
That's what I'd like to know. Why is it that a non-GSP shipper would have no problem shipping it, yet this company cannot? I guarantee all their packages are on the same plane as *insert other shipper here*.
One thing I'm wondering about in my case was that the shipper originally quoted me GBP 50-60 for shipping; however, when I paid my invoice, the shipping was only around GBP 20. I later learned that the GBP 50-60 would be if he had used his typical shipping method (I'm guessing Royal Post). GSP only charged around GBP 20, and almost half of that went to the seller, for some reason (maybe for him to ship it to the warehouse?). So I'm wondering if GSP realized they did not charge enough to cover the shipping fees and basically claimed it as 'undeliverable'. Certainly seems to fall into the 'undeliverable, for whatever reason' category. :-\
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Getting responses from ebay and it's not looking good, unfortunately. This is such BS.
Also, here's some info for one of Jeff's earlier questions:
http://pages.ebay.co.uk/help/buy/shipping-globally.html (http://pages.ebay.co.uk/help/buy/shipping-globally.html)
In particular, see the section Oversized Items.
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They seem to close some of the complaints opened with BBB
http://www.bbb.org/connecticut/business-reviews/mailing-machines-and-equipment/pitney-bowes-inc-in-stamford-ct-47000639/
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They seem to close some of the complaints opened with BBB
http://www.bbb.org/connecticut/business-reviews/mailing-machines-and-equipment/pitney-bowes-inc-in-stamford-ct-47000639/
And there are these complaints. They sound completely non-service oriented and like they could care less about those who have issues with them or their meters. Big, fat negatives all the way around:
http://www.bbb.org/connecticut/business-reviews/mailing-machines-and-equipment/pitney-bowes-inc-in-stamford-ct-47000639/customer-reviews
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I hope this works out well for you. For those that are thinking of using GSP in the future, there is another line here that basically says they do not have to pay if they do not want to.
"eBay shall not be responsible under either the eBay Money Back Guarantee or PayPal Purchase Protection policies if eBay concludes that a GSP Item is not deliverable to your designated delivery address or to the collection center near you that is designated by the shipping carrier, for any reason"
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Christ, that is nothing short of theft!
There has been major changes to shipping from the UK. Packages I've sent with no problem in the past are now being considered oversized. The Post Office simply won't accept them anymore. If I'm not mistaken, I don't think they even accept postal tubes whatsoever. They'll need to be sent with alternative and far more expensive couriers. :-\
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Christ, that is nothing short of theft!
There has been major changes to shipping from the UK. Packages I've sent with no problem in the past are now being considered oversized. The Post Office simply won't accept them anymore. If I'm not mistaken, I don't think they even accept postal tubes whatsoever. They'll need to be sent with alternative and far more expensive couriers. :-\
Summed up rightly, nicely and precisely, ladeda. It's a total ripoff and outrage. moron1
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This is so f'd up.
Finally got a response from the ebay global shipping team. I wanted to know what were the actual dimensions as measured by the shipping center. I converted the cm measurements to inches.
The item dimensions were as follows:
Length: 155.00 --> 61.0236 inches
Width: 21.00 --> 8.26772 inches
Height: 20.00 --> 7.87402 inches
Weight: 9.50
You have been refunded fully for the item. Your item was oversized and could not be shipped forward, these requirements are something that your seller should be well aware of but if they choose to send an item that is too large for our program the seller has made an agreement with eBay and our shipper that we will not return or forward the item. (Please see http://pages.ebay.co.uk/help/buy/shipping-globally.html (http://Please see http://pages.ebay.co.uk/help/buy/shipping-globally.html)).
Follow that link and you will find the following:
Oversized items
For an item to be eligible to be shipped to you through the Global Shipping Programme, the seller's packaging must meet dimension and weight requirements:
The package must not weigh more than 66 lbs.
Dimensions = length + 2 * (width + height).
Length is the longest side of the package.
The package must not exceed 66 inches in length.
The package must not exceed the maximum dimensions of 118 inches.
The package must not exceed the maximum dimensional (DIM) weight of 66 lbs.
Dimensional weight = (length x width x height) / (dimensional factor) where the dimensional factor = 166.
For completeness, please note:
- the maximum dimension does not exceed 66 inches
- length + 2 * (width + height) = 61.0236 + 2 * (8.26772 + 7.87402) = 93.30708 inches which does not exceed 118 inches
So the question is, WHAT THE FUCK!?!?!!!!
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So, you're saying your item wasn't even over sized??
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Get them to go thru the maths with them as sounds you're within the limits
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Oh come on now.....what the heck? It meets the sizing requirements! This is crazy. Doh.gif
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Oh come on now.....what the heck? It meets the sizing requirements! This is crazy. Doh.gif
So true.. its absurd.
And without Mike or the original seller ever able to measure this parcel, (since it has been sucked into the black hole of PB, never to be seen again), PB will continue to say it was X inches over the limit, or the weight was exceeded, and there's no way to prove them wrong.
As ladeda said, this is pure thievery, thru and thru.
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So true.. its absurd.
And without Mike or the original seller ever able to measure this parcel, (since it has been sucked into the black hole of PB, never to be seen again), PB will continue to say it was X inches over the limit, or the weight was exceeded, and there's no way to prove them wrong.
As ladeda said, this is pure thievery, thru and thru.
I believe in Mikes last post the shipping center gave him those dimensions and thats the Crazy part.
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Yup, yup.... ooops... my bad. Doh.gif.
The numbers he was given all fall below the maximums.
So it truly is the Pitney Bowes black hole of shipping death! gun1 gun1
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I will Never Used GSP from Ebay. Sware to God!!!!
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Hey... Pitney Bowes... (http://i629.photobucket.com/albums/uu12/brude2000/GIFS/finger_zpsjqbvywkz.gif) (http://s629.photobucket.com/user/brude2000/media/GIFS/finger_zpsjqbvywkz.gif.html)
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GSP should be banned. Had a Escape from New York poster coming over from the US and it makes it all the way to the UK. Goes through customs then goes to a company called 13ten who hand over to Yodel and the package goes missing in between 13ten and Yodel. No one knows where it is - most likely mislaid in someone's pocket.
I am absolutely fuming!
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devil 2 devil 2 devil 2
devil 2 devil 2 devil 2 devil 2
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devil 2 devil 2 devil 2
devil 2 devil 2 devil 2 devil 2
Sums it up well
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GSP should be banned. Had a Escape from New York poster coming over from the US and it makes it all the way to the UK. Goes through customs then goes to a company called 13ten who hand over to Yodel and the package goes missing in between 13ten and Yodel. No one knows where it is - most likely mislaid in someone's pocket.
I am absolutely fuming!
How long has it been "missing" at this point?
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Was given to Yodel on 17th Nov. I have received an email this morning from 13ten tracking team to say it's officially lost as Yodel can't locate the parcel. The Yodel tracking number says Awaiting Parcel and 13ten is Passed to courier for delivery.
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Wow, that is some shoddy mishandling of your parcel. And it sounds like this Yodel comapny is not telling the truth, if the parcel was passed to their courier.
moron1
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Not good and there is nothing that can be done. Problem is a poster tube is easily recognisable and with the customs form attached you can see exactly whats inside with even opening it!
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The GSP program has been screamed about, loud & clear here, too, and to NOT use it. nono
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There has been major changes to shipping from the UK...The Post Office simply won't accept them anymore. If I'm not mistaken, I don't think they even accept postal tubes whatsoever.
Not true.
I manage a Post Office and happen to be on the eBay Seller Council.
As long as you keep tubes (and boxes) within the given dimensions, you're fine.
Anything that is oversized in terms of the Post Office (Royal Mail) and still within GSP dimensions, either use Parcelforce via the Post Office or another parcel courier.
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Not true.
I manage a Post Office and happen to be on the eBay Seller Council.
As long as you keep tubes (and boxes) within the given dimensions, you're fine.
Anything that is oversized in terms of the Post Office (Royal Mail) and still within GSP dimensions, either use Parcelforce via the Post Office or another parcel courier.
Prolly is a sizing issue because since then I've had flat (albeit large in dimension) packages turned away too.
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Prolly is a sizing issue because since then I've had flat (albeit large in dimension) packages turned away too.
What sort of size are we talking?
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What is interesting too, is that when going to list something for sale or auction, the default, international shipping method (at least here in the US on ebay.com) IS ebay's GPS service. So unless one isnt careful, and doesnt select another mailing option to mail overseas, GPS will automatically be used.
(Of course, a seller can go back and change it later to USPS, FedX etc, if wanted), but it's the idea that it's automatically chosen when going to list an item, that I dont care for.
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Yes and most sellers don't even seem to realize this. But of course eBay wouldnt have it any other way since it is yet another revenue stream for them
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I had to chime in on this one. The Global Shipping Program is one of the worst and immoral scams ever concocted to screw people out of money. eBay "sells" the program to sellers in the UK and USA as a convenient way to ship goods internationally but it is nothing but a way to rip off buyers of their hard earned cash.
As a Canadian, the GSP collects customs duties up-front that I am required to pay by law when importing goods to the country....one problem though; Canada's Customs and Boarder Services Agency (or jack-booted-commie-tax-collecting-pigs as I like to call them), will not charge ANYTHING, zilch, nothing, nadda, on imported goods valued under $100. However, when using the GSP Pitney Bowes collects "customs, duties, and fees" on everything no matter the value in the name of the Canadian government; BUT my own government would not collect the same. Wonder what happens to that money? To make it even worse, when these customs/duties/fees are legitimately due, Pitney Bowes collects an average of 300% MORE $$$ than what my government would actually charge me.
I refuse to buy anything that ships using the GPS because it is a complete an utter rip-off! 9 times out of 10 I find UK and USA sellers will ship to me directly after I explain why I can not, and will not, buy anything using the "program". However there remains some people, some very lazy people, who refuse spend the 30 seconds it takes at the post office to fill out a customs declaration sticker, and will only use the GSP.
All I can say is PLEASE DO NOT USE IT!!!
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100% agree!
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What even is the benefit of the GSP? I mean, you still have to package your item and send it somewhere, right? Why not send it directly to the buyer?
Even if I'm missing some benefit in the equation, I think the negatives in the fine print shared here far outweigh any possible benefit.
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What even is the benefit of the GSP? I mean, you still have to package your item and send it somewhere, right? Why not send it directly to the buyer?
Even if I'm missing some benefit in the equation, I think the negatives in the fine print shared here far outweigh any possible benefit.
I dont think there are ANY benefits in using GSP.
Problem is, this option is selected by default, when creating a listing, so if someone isnt careful by UN-checking the GSP box and then selecting their own shipping method, both the seller and buyer are at the mercy of of the GSP monkeys who may open and rifle thru a parcel before sending it on. eyeroll
Be sure and UN-CHECK that GSP box, before listing a poster (or any item) for sale!!
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I dont think there are ANY benefits in using GSP.
Problem is, this option is selected by default, when creating a listing, so if someone isnt careful by UN-checking the GSP box and then selecting their own shipping method, both the seller and buyer are at the mercy of of the GSP monkeys who may open and rifle thru a parcel before sending it on. eyeroll
Be sure and UN-CHECK that GSP box, before listing a poster (or any item) for sale!!
But why are sellers praising this thing now? Found an auction and it had this in it?
“NOTE: International shipping through the eBay Global Shipping Program ONLY. If your delivery address is not in one of the countries included in the Global Shipping Program, and you purchase this item, the sale will be cancelled forthwith.“
Well, he’s lost a sale for that! Pure stupidity if you ask me. The price of item is 120, shipping is 32, import fee 16. So what’s the point?
Further, you can not! Can not! Add items together in the same order, so you will be charged that shipping cost and import fee per item...
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I agree with you, Big Mike. If you are not able to combine orders to save on international shipping and fees, that is rough for both buyers and sellers. Okie
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Many sellers fear filling out simple customs forms for some odd reason
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I usually try to avoid the ebay global shipping for the reasons discussed frequently here. Now I'd like to share my experience. I was very happy to be able to purchase on ebay a incredibly rare poster (I didn't even know of its existence) located in Washington/USA and the seller accepted transatlantic shipping only via ebay global shipping. The first time in my "career" the poster has arrived at the global shipping center in Erlanger and has been restricted. No explanation was given neither to me nor the seller. The seller was allowed to keep the money I have paid him and I have been fully reimbursed by ebay. So no financial loss but I was heavily frustrated as the poster appeared lost forever.
A few weeks later the very same poster popped up on ebay with the same photos and same listing text (price + 20% than original listing) by the user 8ten1944 located in Michigan but with no international shipping option. I changed the shipping address to a friend of mine in California who received the poster safely and will forward it to me.
I was puzzled and did an online research and found several similar stories. So I can conclude that probabely all restricted goods are not destroyed but handed over to that company in Michigan for reselling in the domestic market. They even receive photos and text. So if ever you loose something because of a restriction follow the user 8ten1944 and if lucky repurchase your item but give them a local adress that can forward you the item directly.