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Author Topic: Wet damage - how to deal with it?  (Read 5187 times)

Offline stripemakers

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Wet damage - how to deal with it?
« on: November 08, 2012, 08:46:33 AM »
Hello people,

i recently found some really nice posters, but they were in a wet place - they are still in really nice condition, but most of them are wavy becouse they got some wet.

Do you guys have any good idea how to deal with this? I made a quick search, and on some sites people advices to put them under a textile sheets and to simply iron them one by one. Do you think its a good idea, or its better to ask the help of someone professional?

Thanks!
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Offline jayn_j

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Re: Wet damage - how to deal with it?
« Reply #1 on: November 08, 2012, 09:23:14 AM »
get them flat with some even weight on them.  Like in a pile of posters.  Then wait.  wait some more.  patience is a virtue.  Eventually they will flatten.
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Offline CSM

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Re: Wet damage - how to deal with it?
« Reply #2 on: November 08, 2012, 09:31:50 AM »
Getting them linenbacked is also an option...
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Chris

Offline Harry Caul

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Re: Wet damage - how to deal with it?
« Reply #3 on: November 08, 2012, 09:40:27 AM »
I'm curious about this as well... I'm not sure weight+time will ever truly flatten out moisture ripples.  I would think you need to reintroduce a tiny bit of moisture and heat.  Something like misting it with a deacidification spray and then ironing it on a very low setting.  Then weight + time.
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Offline stripemakers

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Re: Wet damage - how to deal with it?
« Reply #4 on: November 08, 2012, 09:53:00 AM »
Thanks for the tips...

Harry: i was thinking about the same, but i am a bit affraid that i would destroy them. But i think first i will try this method on some non-valuable posters...

Or first to try the less dangerous method, just to put them on a flat place, and put some weight on them.


any other ideas?

thanks!
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Offline CSM

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Re: Wet damage - how to deal with it?
« Reply #5 on: November 08, 2012, 09:58:14 AM »
Do they have any water staining or mold?
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Chris

Offline stripemakers

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Re: Wet damage - how to deal with it?
« Reply #6 on: November 08, 2012, 10:06:59 AM »
Fortunately no, they are only wavy. Thanks!
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Offline CSM

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Re: Wet damage - how to deal with it?
« Reply #7 on: November 08, 2012, 10:48:11 AM »
Quote from: stripemakers on November 08, 2012, 10:06:59 AM
Fortunately no, they are only wavy. Thanks!

In my experience, the paper consistency changes after exposure to moisture.  The paper becomes more brittle and stiff and therefore less pliable.

If they are "valuable" posters and you want to preserve them - I would consider having them linenbacked.

If not, try putting even weight on them (for a long time) as others have suggested.  I would not, personally, introduce anymore moisture/water to them unless you are feeling brave or want to experiment ;)
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Offline Harry Caul

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Re: Wet damage - how to deal with it?
« Reply #8 on: November 08, 2012, 10:50:42 AM »
Yes, I should be clear... I've never tried this and I wouldn't do it with anything of value.  But I have considered experimenting...
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Offline Silhouette

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Re: Wet damage - how to deal with it?
« Reply #9 on: November 08, 2012, 01:53:31 PM »
'Pressing' paper that size will likely add ripples because you are trapping the entire sheet under a heavy weight yet telling it it needs to stretch.

You might consider asking a restorer for best advice (since the posters are so valuable), also as has been mentioned by Harry, re-introducing moisture may help, experiment on the cheap stuff first:

Dear Dario: http://www.vintagemovieart.ca/dear-dario/flatten-rolled-posters/
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David

Offline CSM

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Re: Wet damage - how to deal with it?
« Reply #10 on: November 08, 2012, 02:10:59 PM »
When is Dario going to start offering relationship/marriage advice via "Dear Dario"?  ;)
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Chris

Charlie

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Re: Wet damage - how to deal with it?
« Reply #11 on: November 08, 2012, 02:15:58 PM »
You have to humidify the entire poster evenly just need a tray of water, lamp, and cover...  then press it with layer of polyester, blotter paper, felt, plexi, and weight... Or take it to a frame shop and have them press it with a heat vacu-seal - the same the use for mounting without the felt and plexi...
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Offline Harry Caul

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Re: Wet damage - how to deal with it?
« Reply #12 on: November 08, 2012, 02:25:08 PM »
What humidity level do you think the paper would need to be at before the fibers would relax? 

I was also thinking that if straight water might be damaging... could you instead slather on a bunch of besting to saturate the paper and relax the fibers.  Then as you are pressing it flat (cover with plexi and roller?) the bestine would evaporate and not harm the fibers or colors long-term.  If using that much bestine, though, make sure you work in a ventilated room!
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Charlie

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Re: Wet damage - how to deal with it?
« Reply #13 on: November 08, 2012, 03:43:47 PM »
Check out these videos... I had run across them when researching conservation...

Here is the one about flattening...



Distilled I am sure...  The paper may curl, but it will be flat.
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Offline erik1925

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Re: Wet damage - how to deal with it?
« Reply #14 on: November 08, 2012, 05:26:05 PM »


You might also want to fire off an email to several of the well respected poster restorers who have been doing this for 20+ years and get their feedback. People like John Davis of Poster Mountain and Dario Casadei are both tops in their field and each will more than likely email you back with their recommendations and suggestions, too.



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-Jeff

Charlie

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Re: Wet damage - how to deal with it?
« Reply #15 on: November 08, 2012, 05:34:11 PM »
Quote from: erik1925 on November 08, 2012, 05:26:05 PM

You might also want to fire off an email to several of the well respected poster restorers who have been doing this for 20+ years and get their feedback. People like John Davis of Poster Mountain and Dario Casadei are both tops in their field and each will more than likely email you back with their recommendations and suggestions, too.





I guess the Smithsonian hasn't been at it that long...  hitself

PM just did a blog post on what to do after paper gets wet in conjunction with the Sandy mess...

http://www.postermountain.blogspot.com/
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Offline Harry Caul

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Re: Wet damage - how to deal with it?
« Reply #16 on: November 08, 2012, 10:49:49 PM »
Quote from: Charlie on November 08, 2012, 03:43:47 PM
Check out these videos... I had run across them when researching conservation...

Here is the one about flattening...



Distilled I am sure...  The paper may curl, but it will be flat.

Fascinating stuff.  I wonder what PM charges to flatten something like the THEM! poster?  Seems you could combine their flattening/bleaching with the Smithsonian's mending and then touch up the folds... all without ever having to back the poster. 

Might need to learn how to do this myself...
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Offline erik1925

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Re: Wet damage - how to deal with it?
« Reply #17 on: November 08, 2012, 10:58:00 PM »
Quote from: Charlie on November 08, 2012, 05:34:11 PM
I guess the Smithsonian hasn't been at it that long...  hitself

PM just did a blog post on what to do after paper gets wet in conjunction with the Sandy mess...

http://www.postermountain.blogspot.com/

As i said, to get input from various sources and then make a decision on how one wants to proceed, can never be a bad thing.

Whether it be the Smithsonian or a reputable and knowledgeable restorer/conservator (like Poster Mountain), it's all about gathering information to obtain the best result, in the long run.   cheers
« Last Edit: November 08, 2012, 11:04:26 PM by erik1925 »
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-Jeff

Charlie

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Re: Wet damage - how to deal with it?
« Reply #18 on: November 09, 2012, 07:17:03 AM »
Quote from: Harry Caul on November 08, 2012, 10:49:49 PM
Fascinating stuff.  I wonder what PM charges to flatten something like the THEM! poster?  Seems you could combine their flattening/bleaching with the Smithsonian's mending and then touch up the folds... all without ever having to back the poster. 

Might need to learn how to do this myself...

I actually looked into the vacu-seal tables and you can pick up a used one for $1500...  I think it would be awesome to just do what you said... Prepare, mend, flatten, and done...  I am so tired of touch-ups partly because I am rather helpless with colors but the poster is never really the same once you put colors on it...
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Offline stripemakers

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Re: Wet damage - how to deal with it?
« Reply #19 on: November 12, 2012, 11:12:01 AM »
Thanks guys, your advices helped me a lot!
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Offline paul waines

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Re: Wet damage - how to deal with it?
« Reply #20 on: November 12, 2012, 11:32:41 AM »
I'm a big fan of Flattening folds with weight, as seen in the Patented Waines press... ;)

However, I found ripples come out better with rolling. Again time is the key. Roll the poster around a tube tightly, and lay flat
on a desk with the poster edge, down on the desk. Then put a weight on it so it won't unravel, leave for a few days, then Reverse
roll the poster, and leave the same way for a few days. This can be done a couple of times, it's worked fine for me in the past.

I'm wondering if a moist atmosphere will speed up the process....?? e.g.. Bathroom....mm, I may give it ago if I get another one
that needs ripples removing...
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