I'm a Newbie... and I Need Guidance

[TheAnswerMVP2001]

Well, I've recently been bitten by the poster bug and am about to throw down a couple bills on an Italian monster (I probably will have already clicked Buy It Now, by the time someone reads this so I can start thinking about important things again and stop this from consuming my thoughts for the past day and a half!)

Anyhow my question is related to framing this beast, because it's about 4.5 feet wide and 6.5 feet tall (55 x 78) I guess I broke the old rule of "starting small and working your way up"!

So my next task is looking for an affordable frame that if anything else will protect it from tearing, it's going to be in a room that rarely gets direct sunlight.  I've been in contact with Spotlight Displays who I know a lot of people here are probably familiar with.  I'm probably going to go with him for the frame simply due to relatively low cost and ease of use, but the problem is he can't cut the overlays to the size I'd need for the poster.  So I'm stuck looking for someone who carries Vivak UV PETG in the 60 x 96 sheets and can cut it for me.  Found quite a few plastic companies who carry Vivak but I haven't heard back from anyone and I have a feeling they're just going to have the regular Vivak not the UV and I guess there's a UV that's clear on both sides and one that's clear on one side and non-glare on the other, which will probably give me more trouble to find.

So anyone have any suggestions?  Anyone know of someone who has access to the larger sheets of Vivak UV with the non-glare?  Do I even really need the non-glare as again this is going to be in a room that's not going to get a whole lot of sunlight?  Are there any other options?  I was also talking with Sue over at Hollywood Poster Frames (another person I'm sure most of you are familiar with) she said with a poster this size she'd use acrylic and a Artcare backing.  Would something like that work with a Spotlight Display?  I'm willing to pay a little more for acrylic over Vivak if it will work in my frame and it saves me the time hunting the Vivak down, as time is money, (although I haven't heard back from Sue on the price of the acrylic so I don't know how much that would be).

So any tips someone can give me would be appreciated.  I've already (or am about to) spend more on my first poster than I really wanted to but this one really caught my eye and I've never seen it anywhere before, so I'd like to keep the frame costs down if I possibly can.  I'm pretty much sold on using Spotlight Display for the outer frame, unless someone has some valid reasons not to, so finding the Vivak UV or a suitable substitute is really what I need help with.

[jayn_j]

Since nobody else has chimed in, I will toss in a comment or two and then wait for wiser folks.

I am suspicious of Vivak in larger sizes.  It is already kind of flimsy in 1 sheet size and would have issues as you get larger.  Based on my reading, I think it is produced in 51" rolls, so you may not be able to get it at any rate.

IMHO, Sue is giving good advice.  I have framed 3 sheets, and I found I needed to go with a thicker acryllic, at least 5/16".  A foam backing is the minimum, and I have mostly used masonite with a barrier layer.  Heavier, but it stays put.

I have a couple of Thierry hates "French Grande"s and a Bus Stop for a Broadway play I am considering hanging, and I have been thinking about mounting directly to the wall.  I would use the foamboard backing, acrylic glazing and then notch 1x3 stock to support it.  Drill holes through it and place into wall anchors.  You can hide or highlight the screws by either using decorative brass, or by countersink drilling for plugs.

I like the spotlight displays, but I think they work best in smaller sizes.  They are difficult to manage as you get larger, and the posters tend to slip out.  If you want a larger size, I would go with Sue.  I'm not sure she ships something this large though.  If you live in Southern Cal, no problem.  Otherwise it might be best to look locally for the glazing, and then buy the rails online.  Grafik Dimensions (www.pictureframes.com) is a reasonable source of rails.

Non-glare glazing is purely your call.  Costs more, but it makes a big difference in viewing angles.

[jayn_j]

One more thing about posters.  Be prepared to spend big bucks on framing them.  It is frustrating when you are spending $150 to hang a $30 poster. 

When costing a larger frame, I figure about $0.10/sq inch. ($0.25/sq inch if you go to Michaels )

[ATLfun]

Since nobody else has chimed in, I will toss in a comment or two and then wait for wiser folks.

  I am certainly not one of the wiser people in the group.  Just ask Mel or Charlie.   

  But the only thing I will add, is that I am up to almost 40 frames from Sue at HP.  And I am so thankful that I paid for the non-glare on all of them.  Also, I trust her advice 110%.  So if Jay and Sue agree, then that would be good enough for me.


  Brian

[TheAnswerMVP2001]

I like the spotlight displays, but I think they work best in smaller sizes.  They are difficult to manage as you get larger, and the posters tend to slip out.  If you want a larger size, I would go with Sue.  I'm not sure she ships something this large though.  If you live in Southern Cal, no problem.  Otherwise it might be best to look locally for the glazing, and then buy the rails online.  Grafik Dimensions (www.pictureframes.com) is a reasonable source of rails.

Non-glare glazing is purely your call.  Costs more, but it makes a big difference in viewing angles.

I'm about an hour or so away from Sue, but I don't know if the gas money is worth it on something I should be able to get a little closer to home.  Also I found her prices on real large items to be a little too steep for my first purchase.  Quote on a French one panel was about $300 so I could only imagine what a 55 x 78 would be, then again I'm new to the game.  I've always heard framing was expensive.  In terms of the spotlight displays what size do they start to become cumbersome?  I was actually first looking at them for a couple French one panels I had in mind and the idea of easily being able to swap them out was appealing.

[Charlie]

  I am certainly not one of the wiser people in the group.  Just ask Mel or Charlie.  

  But the only thing I will add, is that I am up to almost 40 frames from Sue at HP.  And I am so thankful that I paid for the non-glare on all of them.  Also, I trust her advice 110%.  So if Jay and Sue agree, then that would be good enough for me.


  Brian

I am wise to framing; I don't use them...  Unless the things hangs in direct sunlight for months and months you'd be better off just hanging it bare and changing out your light bulbs to LED it would be cheaper than buying a frame for that monster.  Else if you really need a frame you need to find someone with a Tax ID to make it reasonable.  You can order sheets of acrylic/plexiglass online.  (I've never done this though).  I have always thought one way to display these monsters would be to get wall to glass connectors, hang the poster up naked and then place a UV protected acrylic sheet over it. The key is finding a full panel to cover the poster.  Else you could use similar glass to glass connectors and two sheets; I don't think it would detract too much.  However I think with some research you can find the larger stuff with UV protection.  Else there are 60x96 sheets in the link below...  Oh and you would have to use magnets etc. and that new metallic primer etc. to hang the poster up bare (with rare earth discs).

Sheeting:
http://www.eplastics.com/Plastic/Plexiglass_Acrylic_Sheet

Wall to Glass / Glass to Glass Connectors:
http://www.olimpiahardware.com/temp_glass/index5_en.html

[TheAnswerMVP2001]

I am wise to framing; I don't use them...  Unless the things hangs in direct sunlight for months and months you'd be better off just hanging it bare and changing out your light bulbs to LED it would be cheaper than buying a frame for that monster.  Else if you really need a frame you need to find someone with a Tax ID to make it reasonable.  You can order sheets of acrylic/plexiglass online.  (I've never done this though).  I have always thought one way to display these monsters would be to get wall to glass connectors, hang the poster up naked and then place a UV protected acrylic sheet over it. The key is finding a full panel to cover the poster.  Else you could use similar glass to glass connectors and two sheets; I don't think it would detract too much.  However I think with some research you can find the larger stuff with UV protection.  Else there are 60x96 sheets in the link below...  Oh and you would have to use magnets etc. and that new metallic primer etc. to hang the poster up bare (with rare earth discs).

Sheeting:
http://www.eplastics.com/Plastic/Plexiglass_Acrylic_Sheet

Wall to Glass / Glass to Glass Connectors:
http://www.olimpiahardware.com/temp_glass/index5_en.html

I would go bare, but I have a cat, and this sucker will probably hang low to the ground so I can only imagine how long it would last!  The other comments started to shy me away from the Spotlight, and I think you've somewhat taken me back to them.  I contacted them again and they said an acrylic would work fine with their frame up to a certain thickness.  One full sheet was what I was looking for in the Vivak, and the manufacturer does carry it in 60x96, people keep telling me the acrylic in that size would cost an arm and a leg to ship.  I'm still waiting on people to get back to me on the Vivak, but that or finding someone here local who can do acrylic might be the route.  I figure spotlight display and Vivak or acrylic is better protection than nothing, I'm really more worried about it getting torn or really dusty than anything, and at least if I ever want to take it down or out it would be much easier.  At this point I might not even fool with hanging it, it's taller than I am.  I might just put it in a Spotlight and sit it on floor against the wall!  Still I'm back to finding someone who can get me the overlays...

[jayn_j]

Has anyone ever seen non-glare acrylic in a width > 48"?

To answer the earlier question, I built a 27x40 lightbox from the spotlight frame.  The two layers of Vivak are somewhat floppy in there.  When someone closes a door, you can see it flex.  One of my kids tossed a ball into it and it popped loose from one side.  Kind of an extreme example.  I also had an issue where it was difficult to keep everything aligned on a 1 sheet while closing all 4 sides.  Mel mentioned this as well, and added if you do it wrong it will pinch the poster.

[brude]

  to APF, Answer.
Dig your Common Sense Movie Reviews site.
Bookmarked it I have.
My question: what poster did you buy and when are you gonna let us see it? 

[TheAnswerMVP2001]

to APF, Answer.
Dig your Common Sense Movie Reviews site.
Bookmarked it I have.
My question: what poster did you buy and when are you gonna let us see it?  

Thanks very much!  Unfortunately I don't have the time to post as much as I used to but it's fun writing reviews, it's therapeutic.  Also I'll unveil my poster purchase which I did make last night.  Kinda goes with the whole rare Italian film vibe I've currently been getting into over the last couple years, which is somewhat reflective of some of the newer reviews I do.  It's the Italian poster for City of Fear starring Marisa Mell, never seen the film, in fact I can't find the film even through rare movie torrent sites, but I'm a pretty big fan of some of the lesser known cult Italian film actress like Marisa Mell, Barbara Bouchet, Helga Line and this poster just grabbed me, has that classic Italian 60's almost Noir vibe to it.



In terms of my overlay search it looks like finding Vivak UV is going to be pretty impossible in the size I need, most people don't carry it, and for them to order it they'd have to do it in bulk, so one of the companies recommended sign grade acrylic with UV protection which is a reasonable price, I've asked him if it's acid free and the quality that won't yellow, so will see where that goes.

[brude]

That is a beauty. Thanks for sharing.
It's nice to see someone with such fine taste join this board of neanderthals.
                                                                                             

[TheAnswerMVP2001]

That is a beauty. Thanks for sharing.
It's nice to see someone with such fine taste join this board of neanderthals.
                                                                                            

  Thanks! Glad I can help class up the place! (just kidding) So far you all seem like great folks.

[jayn_j]

Very nice poster.  I'd hang it on my walls if I was lucky enough to own it.

[CJ138]

Welcome to the forum! I have bought from eplastics before and built my own frame for a French 1 panel (or whatever you guys call it these days).  Mel, could spotlight displays provide a frame for a poster this size to your knowledge?

Conor

[TheAnswerMVP2001]

Welcome to the forum! I have bought from eplastics before and built my own frame for a French 1 panel (or whatever you guys call it these days).  Mel, could spotlight displays provide a frame for a poster this size to your knowledge?

Conor

I can confirm they do have a French 1 Panel on their site, because originally I was thinking of buying a poster that size.  I believe they want about $135 for it, and that would come with overlays, unlike the size I have.

[Harry Caul]

I've framed some big posters before, including the 4-foglio from this thread so I might be of some help.  First a few things:

• If Sue can frame a French 1-panel with UV/non-glare plexi and artcare backing for $300 -- that is a great deal!  The plexi alone is probably $150.  And Sue is the only person in the country I've been able to find that can get a piece of artcare that is larger than 40x60... she just couldn't get it to me in South Carolina.  Take that Frenchy to a framer and I guarantee any quote will be $800+, probably over $1000 if you use anything other than a thin metal frame.  Not sure what Sue charges for a 4-foglio, but I'm sure its worth it.
• I framed my French 1-panel myself and it cost about $370 with all the materials... but I bought my own decorative wood frame from eBay ($170 unassembled), 2 pieces of 40x60 artcare (~$40) to back the poster, another regular piece of 48x96 foam core to back the 2-piece artcare, and a 48x96 piece of UV/non-glare plexi cut to size and delivered from about 45min away (~$150).
• I did the same for my Italian 4-foglio... the frame was bigger this time (~$200), and because the SOB was so big I had to use 4 pieces of foam core -- 2 40x60 artcares to go behind the poster and 2 pieces of regular foam core (alternated) to go behind that ($50).  As for plexi, I couldn't find non-glare in an oversized piece... you need 60x96.  I think it was like $250 cut and delivered.  Still, I feel like I made out pretty well for just over $500.
• Spotlights seem like a good deal, but I'm no so sure that they will offer *any* UV protection.  I've seen some data sheets on their vivak and the wording never lists a UV protection rating for whatever goes behind the vivak.  They only say how the product is UV stable and won't "yellow" in direct sunlight.  So I have a feeling their UV protection is for the vivak, not what you have framed.
• Still, I'm thinking of picking up one of their french 1-panel frames for $135 and putting a piece of UV/non-glare plexi in front.  I'm not sure the snap frames are deep enough to handle both plexi and foamcore backing, so I'll probably just use the vivak for backing.  Its a linen backed poster anyway...

Hope that helps!

[Charlie]

I've framed some big posters before, including the 4-foglio from this thread so I might be of some help. 

Nice Eames chair; an original rosewood version is on my wish list...

[Harry Caul]

Nice Eames chair; an original rosewood version is on my wish list...

Thanks, ours is only walnut... I would normally never drop that kind of money on a chair, but I found a deal I could pass up. It was listed on Craigslist Charlotte for $1000 and I just happened to check the instant it was listed. I immediately said I'd take it and that I would drive up the next day and pick it up. It was a Saturday so the banks were closed... I had to do 4 different ATM withdrawals to get enough funds.  I was also paranoid that it would be a knock off so I spent all night trying to figure out how to authenticate one. When I got there the next day the woman said she had been getting offers all afternoon after I responded... Some for more than double her asking price!  She said knew it was worth more when she listed it, but that it was time to let it go.  She bought it new for her husband in 2004 as a gift... apparently he had been lusting after one his whole life. Well, sad story, but he only got to use it a couple times before he had a freak stoke and passed away. She said she couldn't bare to look at it and put it in storage. She finally got to the point where she decided to let it go and listed it. She said she didn't care about the higher offers and was very happy to know that it was going to a young academic couple with a new house and a new baby on the way.

There are a few really minor scuffs on it from being moved and bumped in storage. However for the price we felt very lucky. I figured even if we used it for 20 years we could still turn around and sell it for double what we paid. I'm a sucker for a deal :-)

[Harry Caul]

By the way, here is what the FFOD looks like now...

[jayn_j]

[quote author=Harry Caul link=topic=3136.msg47663#msg47663 date=1316782741Spotlights seem like a good deal, but I'm no so sure that they will offer *any* UV protection.  I've seen some data sheets on their vivak and the wording never lists a UV protection rating for whatever goes behind the vivak.  They only say how the product is UV stable and won't "yellow" in direct sunlight.  So I have a feeling their UV protection is for the vivak, not what you have framed.

Still, I'm thinking of picking up one of their french 1-panel frames for $135 and putting a piece of UV/non-glare plexi in front.  I'm not sure the snap frames are deep enough to handle both plexi and foamcore backing, so I'll probably just use the vivak for backing.  Its a linen backed poster anyway...
[/quote]

By default, the Spotlight frames come with 2 layers of Vivak, front and back of the poster.  I tried putting some 18" plexi in there and it was OK.  Also tried using standard foamcore backing and that didn't work very well.  The foamcore is about the depth of the channel, so it was difficult to align the poster and Vivak properly against it.  The frame also bowed out and had gaps at the corners.  I can't recommend foamcore, and would say only use thin plexi.  But if you are using thin plexi, why not simply use the Vivak?

Here is a data sheet from Bayer on UV transmission: http://www.framersbrand.com/FBDataSheet.pdf  It shows blocking for two different brands ov Vivak and implies 100% blocking in the uV region.  The A22 blocking would extend into the visible violet region (38-450 nm) so it might mute deep purples.

[Charlie]

Ok have Friday off so I figure I would give into my curiosity and try to make a floating frame for a daybill.  Bought enough materials to do two for ~$50...  Basically I am going to put T nuts in the wall and use washers to create space and lock it down with thumb screws.  The house frame strapping I will anchor to the wall cover in acid free plastic and then use the magnets to hold up the poster. I'll report back in a few hours....

[Charlie]

Thanks, ours is only walnut... I would normally never drop that kind of money on a chair, but I found a deal I could pass up. It was listed on Craigslist Charlotte for $1000 and I just happened to check the instant it was listed. I immediately said I'd take it and that I would drive up the next day and pick it up. It was a Saturday so the banks were closed... I had to do 4 different ATM withdrawals to get enough funds.  I was also paranoid that it would be a knock off so I spent all night trying to figure out how to authenticate one. When I got there the next day the woman said she had been getting offers all afternoon after I responded... Some for more than double her asking price!  She said knew it was worth more when she listed it, but that it was time to let it go.  She bought it new for her husband in 2004 as a gift... apparently he had been lusting after one his whole life. Well, sad story, but he only got to use it a couple times before he had a freak stoke and passed away. She said she couldn't bare to look at it and put it in storage. She finally got to the point where she decided to let it go and listed it. She said she didn't care about the higher offers and was very happy to know that it was going to a young academic couple with a new house and a new baby on the way.

There are a few really minor scuffs on it from being moved and bumped in storage. However for the price we felt very lucky. I figured even if we used it for 20 years we could still turn around and sell it for double what we paid. I'm a sucker for a deal :-)

Yeah, that was a steal. Especially in such good shape.  I once found a walnut one with that orangey brown 70's color leather for $400, but the leather in the arm rest needed replacing and the back had been water damaged or something (it didn't separate the plywood - that is why I love these chairs they are almost indestructible) so I figured after I refinished the wood and had the whole thing re apolstered in leather I was looking at another $1200, so I passed.  Still think about that chair every time I see someone elses.

[TheAnswerMVP2001]

I've framed some big posters before, including the 4-foglio from this thread so I might be of some help.  First a few things:

• I did the same for my Italian 4-foglio... the frame was bigger this time (~$200), and because the SOB was so big I had to use 4 pieces of foam core -- 2 40x60 artcares to go behind the poster and 2 pieces of regular foam core (alternated) to go behind that ($50).  As for plexi, I couldn't find non-glare in an oversized piece... you need 60x96.  I think it was like $250 cut and delivered.  Still, I feel like I made out pretty well for just over $500.

I've found a local plastics company who has acrylic and quoted me about $85 per sheet that would fit the 55x78 spotlight I plan on getting.  They called it "sign grade" acrylic, but it was UV protective. I'm just waiting to hear back from them if it's also acid free, or if they have anything else that might suit my needs.  At this point I'm not too worried about glare, and even if the acrylic isn't top notched I'm really not worried about yellowing.  This poster is not going to see a lot of sun action.  At this stage I'm not going to be too picky.  So as long as I can find some acid free and relatively UV protective close by for a cheap price I'll go for it.  From what I gather from Spotlight Displays you can probably use about any kind of plexi or plastic on both overlays as long as the combined thickness of the two sheets doesn't go over .250 inches.

[Charlie]

Ok have Friday off so I figure I would give into my curiosity and try to make a floating frame for a daybill.  Bought enough materials to do two for ~$50...  Basically I am going to put T nuts in the wall and use washers to create space and lock it down with thumb screws.  The house frame strapping I will anchor to the wall cover in acid free plastic and then use the magnets to hold up the poster. I'll report back in a few hours....

Well it wasn't a walk in the park.  The first piece of plexiglass snapped when I was drilling one of the holes.  I was holding the corner and the pressure from the drill created too much moment for the material. Else the hardest part was actually finding my stack of daybills.  One down fall was the varying length of the daybills. I adjusted by moving up the bottom strap but then the magnets are in the actual image.  The other con was that during drilling or something the holes were tad off and this created a bit of a warp in the plastic that I will have to adjust by wallowing out two of the holes.  There was also remaining static which lifted the poster clinging to the plexiglass.  Else I am not taking it down...

[Charlie]

OK major fail!  I pulled it down to increase the size of the holes and had put a piece of plastic under the plexiglass (stupid) when the bit made it through it sucked up the plastic and snapped the second piece.  My new opinion is to just buy a frame... I'm done with this crap; wasted half a day....  Now I have to fix the wall; stupid plexiglass..  Or buy another piece...