Clockwork Orange R1973

[Dread_Pirate_Mel]

Some of us have been discussing this auction behind the scenes.  This extremely rare 1973 "R rating" re-release of Clockwork Orange popped up on eBay five days ago and sold for $6,676, zooming up in the last day from $300. It has sold in the $14K to 19K range at Heritage and Christies. Its general legitimacy and background have been discussed in the last few days in this thread on NS4.  The seller told me he is long-term collector and that he bought it in 1989 from a poster store in Hollywood (I believe it was Hollywood Movie Posters.)

[Harry Caul]

I was pretty skeptical as the the seller stopped responding to questions for a few days after I offered to pay for it to be independently authenticated at MPGrading. However, late last night they finally responded and offered to have it sent to MPGrading before I even pay!  Unfortunately my bid topped out in the high 5's. 'Grats to whoever landed it!

[Dread_Pirate_Mel]

Based on everything I've read and my correspondence with the seller I think these posters were printed in the early 70s but were never sent to theaters. They are extraordinarily rare and and every known copy is rolled. Even though the re-release was a failure, surely a few folded copies would have surfaced by now had this design actually been used in theaters.

[Bruce]

It is certainly possible that this was printed in 1973 and never used. But it is also possible it was actually printed in the 1980s, and that they decided to go with THIS design instead: (http://www.emovieposter.com/agallery/archiveitem/6803188.html)



The two posters are virtually identical except for the changed taglines. Of course one could argue that when they reissued it in the 1980s, someone dusted off the unused 1973 design and reused it. I would love to have Todd Spoor sent the two posters so he could do a side-by-side analysis of the age of each.

Bruce

[Dread_Pirate_Mel]

It is certainly possible that this was printed in 1973 and never used. But it is also possible it was actually printed in the 1980s, and that they decided to go with THIS design instead....

Possible but the tagline "announcing the breakthrough presentation...." only makes sense in the 1973 context since they were "announcing" the new "R rating" version.  It would not have made sense to design or print a poster in the 1980s "announcing" such old news.

[Dread_Pirate_Mel]

And by the way, how do we know that second folded poster is from the 1980s?  That third sentence - "a great film whose time has come" - makes more sense in the 1970s close to the time it came out rather than in the 1980s when it had been out for a long time.  Perhaps somebody could track down the dates of those quotes in the first two sentences.

[Dread_Pirate_Mel]

Just found this: Bunuel made the statement" "it is the only film about what the modern world means" when the movie came out.



That means the second folded poster could have been printed in 1973.  Perhaps the second folded poster was actually released to theaters in 1973 and the first rolled poster "announcing" was a rejected prototype.

[Harry Caul]

Seems unlikely that Fellini would have called it "the visionary film of the 70's" if the 70's were only just beginning.  When is he quoted as saying that?  I would guess late 70's at the earliest... or post-70's which would make the most sense.

[Dread_Pirate_Mel]

Ha-ha!  The Dread Pirate Mel has discovered this gem from February 1975:

[Dread_Pirate_Mel]

Which means this poster may be worth 100 times what it sold for in 2002:

[Bruce]

100 times is too conservative. I'd say at least 1,000 times, since there only seems to be one of those and God knows how many of the other.

Bruce

[Harry Caul]

Based on everything I've read and my correspondence with the seller I think these posters were printed in the early 70s but were never sent to theaters. They are extraordinarily rare and and every known copy is rolled. Even though the re-release was a failure, surely a few folded copies would have surfaced by now had this design actually been used in theaters.

Maybe it was a wilding poster for the R re-cut (an hence probably only used in LA and NYC)?  Wilding posters seem to be the only other posters that were printed in mass, but that were not folded (pre-80s anyway).  There are a bunch of psychadelic eye posters for 2001 ASO that are rolled as well. 

[Dread_Pirate_Mel]

Maybe it was a wilding poster for the R re-cut (an hence probably only used in LA and NYC)?  Wilding posters seem to be the only other posters that were printed in mass, but that were not folded (pre-80s anyway).  There are a bunch of psychadelic eye posters for 2001 ASO that are rolled as well. 

Maybe the "announcing" is the first re-release poster that was printed and used in 1973 and the second "visionary" poster was printed and used in later years (a similar "visionary" newspaper ad was being used in 1975).

[Bruce]

How come both these posters never surfaced until a few years ago if they were used in 1973 and 1975? And where are the R73 and R75 lobby cards and other items?

Bruce

[MoviePosterBid.com]

How come both these posters never surfaced until a few years ago if they were used in 1973 and 1975? And where are the R73 and R75 lobby cards and other items?

Bruce

Bruce, anothr Kubrick film - 2001 - has re-issues in 1970, 1971, 1972, 1974, 1978 and 1980, yet, there are only lobby cards for 1968 original release and 1972 re-issue. we all know that the NSS warehouses however had plenty of backstock material for decades after any particular film's release, so it's my guess that 1972 cards were printed after 1968 cards were gone. We also know that sizes under 1sheets were in diminished request from theatres until they stopped printing them altogether.

I suspect Clockwork had a fairly large backstock at NSS for quite a long time due to the different way the film was handled by theatres everywhere, including NYC where I lived and that sizes other than 1sheet or larger paper were not commonly displayed for this film.

[Bruce]

I don't know Rich. There are zillions of 2001 posters from every release, and zillions of X or R posters from Clockword Orange, but never ONE poster from either this 1973 or 1975 release until recently?

Bruce

[MoviePosterBid.com]

I don't know Rich. There are zillions of 2001 posters from every release, and zillions of X or R posters from Clockword Orange, but never ONE poster from either this 1973 or 1975 release until recently?
Bruce

I understand arguments surrounding this poster, but my post didn't speak to that. I was only juxtaposing your previous question against some known realities.

That said, I wouldn't be surprised if it is exactly what it's said it is, but it was never distributed and supposedly destroyed, except someone kept a roll and some others got out from other people connected in some way to the film etc.

I also wouldn't be surprised if it was distributed in one city and then abandoned because people were confused by the poster.

[Harry Caul]

More info/speculation from the seller:

And in all the years of collecting, Ive not seen any more. The store I got it from still had a couple left, that was many years ago. I think I know where they got the poster(s). 3 blocks from their store in downtown Hollywood, was a company called TFI. They handled much of the advertising for the studios. Warner Bros. used them for many years. On several occasions I saw many boxes of posters from from TFI in the store. They were somehow buying the posters from TFI. TFI handled press kit and 1-sheet distribution for events, and some theatrical. But also they did the "wild-posting" for the studios. I think this style Clockwork Orange was mainly used for wild-posting, which is why it is uncommon. Just my theory.

By the way, I never mentioned anything about "wilding" posters to the seller... the fact that they mentioned it without provocation makes me think it could indeed be true.  How else do we explain the rolled 2001 wilding posters? 

[Dread_Pirate_Mel]

OK, I checked a few days from the New York Times microfilm.  All I found was this "R" ad from October 12, 1973.  A similar "R" ad ran in November 1973 without the picture.  It does not use the Pelham art but does use the Bunuel "modern world" quote. I didn't find any other ads for Clockwork Orange in March 1974 or February 1975 in the NYT.

I couldn't find any ads at all for Clockwork in the Washington Post during this time period.

[Dread_Pirate_Mel]

Had a discussion with a "high level dealer/collector" who says this is a wilding poster used in LA and NY and that he personally saw them in 73:

[Neo]

Good work on checking out the microfiche and getting confirmation from a higher up. 

[Dread_Pirate_Mel]

Someone sent an email to my MPC email with this info:

As for its origin: I got it [Clockwork Orange] around 1990 in a residential attic, in Maryland. It was rolled, unused and rolled together with many other posters in a tube (including Forbidden Planet and Chinatown...the only other titles I remember). The father of the guy I got it from was a manager of multiple theatres (but he had already died by the time I met the son); all the posters that were saved by the dad were passed on to the son. That is about it. I had no idea at the time as to the rarity of the poster; just that I was a big fan of the film and wanted the poster. Years later I got it professionally linen-backed, along with its original release theatrical "X" rating 1-sheet.