Spotlight Displays

[guest8]

I would love to do something like that, but it would be tough to cut/position the foam core correctly to even be able to think about attaching the poster to it. With a backing of 40x60, I'd have to use like six pieces cut at odd angles, the poster measures just over 82" with backing, so two 40x60 pieces wouldn't make it across if they were both going the same way, and if the second was laid lengthwise, it would make the one now on top of it just short, etc.
Definitely need to figure out something though.

They do make acid free foam core in a 48x96" sheet. I've only seen it available online though and to buy it that way you have to buy a case of 15 or 25 @ $15-22/sheet + shipping. So it can be expensive, but if you could find a local frame shop and maybe talk to them they might be able to order some and sell you a couple.

[Harry Caul]

Thanks for chiming in Robert.  Actually, more important to me than 6-sheet sized overlays would be to get a more accurate measurement of their UV protecting properties.  This is what you have on your website:

Protection:
Each movie poster frame you order comes with 2 overlays, one used for the front and one used for the back, poster will be in between. The overlays are Vivak PETG, one side of the overlay is clear and the other side is non-glare. It is your choice which side you would like to use. From the manufacturer of the overlays, they have UV Protective properties and are Acid Free. That being said, I would not place any poster of value in direct sunlight or strong indoor light for long periods of time. I have posters in our frames right now that have been there for 5 years, with some direct sunlight and indirect sunlight through out the day and I do not see any fading with the naked eye. These are inexpensive posters. I also have posters that are of value in my frames with no sunlight, direct or indirect, only house lighting. They have been in the frames for 10 years, and there is no naked eye visible damage to the posters in any way. No fading, no staining, nothing. The point I am trying to make is, these overlays are safe to use, but no sheet on the market is going to block 100% of Lighting. The great thing about our movie poster frames is you can change the posters out with ease. If you have a $100,000 poster, feel safe in displaying it for a while, but don't leave it in any frame, from anyone for long periods of time, AND NO DIRECT SUNLIGHT!!! (Non-Glare Overlays are only available for movie poster frame sizes up to 73" x 49" and All Clear overlays up to 96" x 48")

And I went to Bayer's site, this is what they say about their UV Vivak: http://www.sheet.bayerpolymers.com/59/Products/Vivak/Vivak-UV.htm

Vivak® UV.

Vivak® UV came on the market in 1992 as the world´s first UV-stabilized thermoplastic-polyester sheet. Thanks to this innovation, the superior deep-drawing properties of Vivak® sheets can be taken advantage of even for external applications with the same versatile processing options and long-term quality.

Special Advantages:

• high resistance to weathering and excellent durability thanks to UV-coating
• 10-year warranty on impact resistance, transparency, and light-permeability

All of their wording on their site and in the spec sheet relates to the UV stability of the overlay itself -- meaning, it's stabilized so it won't yellow in direct sunlight (and is therefore useful for outdoor advertising displays), but it says nothing about how much UV protection it offers to what's underneath.  From my understanding, most of the UV protecting capability of acrylic/plexiglas comes from it's thickness... meaning, the thicker it is the more protection it offers.  Standard 1/8" UV plexi filters approx. 70-80% of UV light.  To get higher than that you need to have special coatings/layers.  That is how the 98% museum quality UV plexi is made.  So basically, if the thickness is what offers the protection, I'm a bit concerned regarding the Vivak as it's so thin.  

Can you please contact your supplier and ask how much protection the UV Vivak offers to what's under it?  I would be happy if it's on par with basic UV plexi -- although if you could get it with a special UV layer for even more protection that would be fantastic.  I love the fact that your overlays are thin enough to roll up, but that is always what worries me most regarding fading.  Thanks!

[CSM]

There are many that are wondering the exact same thing as Matt questioned.

If there can be concrete confirmation that Spotlight's overlays actually do offer a level of real UV protection I am sure many additional sales would result!

[Charlie]

Anyone have an idea how much UV protection you can get from UV windows and light bulbs changes?  I mean if you don't have anything hitting the posters from in the house then why worry?

[CSM]

Anyone have an idea how much UV protection you can get from UV windows and light bulbs changes?  I mean if you don't have anything hitting the posters from in the house then why worry?

I think Matt has UV coating on his windows?

All my posters are on the wall in the basement where there is minimal direct sunlight coming in from a small curtained window.  But I am so paranoid of fading from internal lighting that I have UV protective plexi (from Americanframe.com + HPF) or the supposed UV protective Vivak overlays from Spotlight on all my framed posters in addition to UV-stop halogen potlight bulbs!!

Now if Robert can confirm with certainty that the Vivak really is UV filtering at some level I will be just a little less crazy...

[erik1925]

A cool read/thread started by Steve (50s) on Fading and UV:

http://www.allposterforum.com/index.php/topic,1955.msg26889.html#msg26889

[USMCSS]

Hello Harry and everyone else wanting an answer on overlays. This has been a question I have tried to get an answer to for over 10 years now. For our overlays I have talked to everyone under the sun and have been given so many different answers that I have come to the conclusion that I will never get a straight answer. The one concise answer I get from everyone is there is UV protection in our overlays. That is why I put UV protective Properties for the description.

I have talked to the actual scientist that make the overlays I use and he stated that they indeed are UV protective but would not give me a true number on how protective they are.

So my faith in these overlays comes from personal experience. What I write in the description of my overlays is true when I talk about the light exposer on my posters while in the frames. I have never noticed any fading to the naked eye.

I have just purchased a hand held over scanner that will determine fading. I was going to perform an experiment with the overlays and posters in direct sunlight using the scanner this summer but did not gave the time. I am still planning on doing it.

I stake my reputation on saying that any poster displayed in our frames with in house lighting will not see any fading for at least 10 years, and also with direct and indirect sunlight periodically throughout the day.

I could write that my overlays are 75% 85% 98% or anything in between but I would never do that because I live my life with Honor, Integrity, and Respect!

It is completely understandable to be worried about protecting your posters. But I think we all need to worry a little less and enjoy displaying our posters. And change them out from time to time. And don't have them in direct sunlight for long periods and none if you can help it. No overlay in the world is going to protect from that.

[USMCSS]

I think Matt has UV coating on his windows?

All my posters are on the wall in the basement where there is minimal direct sunlight coming in from a small curtained window.  But I am so paranoid of fading from internal lighting that I have UV protective plexi (from Americanframe.com + HPF) or the supposed UV protective Vivak overlays from Spotlight on all my framed posters in addition to UV-stop halogen potlight bulbs!!

Now if Robert can confirm with certainty that the Vivak really is UV filtering at some level I will be just a little less crazy...

Hello Chris, just saw your post after I made my last one. Just curious what makes you believe that American Frames overlays are UV Protective and that my overlays are suppositly UV Protective?  Because they wrote it in their description?

[USMCSS]

A cool read/thread started by Steve (50s) on Fading and UV:

http://www.allposterforum.com/index.php/topic,1955.msg26889.html#msg26889

Great post Erik and Steve!

[erik1925]

Hello Harry and everyone else wanting an answer on overlays. This has been a question I have tried to get an answer to for over 10 years now. For our overlays I have talked to everyone under the sun and have been given so many different answers that I have come to the conclusion that I will never get a straight answer. The one concise answer I get from everyone is there is UV protection in our overlays. That is why I put UV protective Properties for the description.

I have talked to the actual scientist that make the overlays I use and he stated that they indeed are UV protective but would not give me a true number on how protective they are.

So my faith in these overlays comes from personal experience. What I write in the description of my overlays is true when I talk about the light exposer on my posters while in the frames. I have never noticed any fading to the naked eye.

I have just purchased a hand held over scanner that will determine fading. I was going to perform an experiment with the overlays and posters in direct sunlight using the scanner this summer but did not gave the time. I am still planning on doing it.

I stake my reputation on saying that any poster displayed in our frames with in house lighting will not see any fading for at least 10 years, and also with direct and indirect sunlight periodically throughout the day.

I could write that my overlays are 75% 85% 98% or anything in between but I would never do that because I live my life with Honor, Integrity, and Respect!

It is completely understandable to be worried about protecting your posters. But I think we all need to worry a little less and enjoy displaying our posters. And change them out from time to time. And don't have them in direct sunlight for long periods and none if you can help it. No overlay in the world is going to protect from that.

Hi Robert,

The one comment I bolded above in your post is something that caught my eye and I don't quite understand. How and why would the scientist/manufacturer who produces your overlays NOT give you the exact UV protective rating number, if they are, in fact, true UV rated overlays? That information would be key (and basic) to anyone wanting (you as the seller) as well as any potential customer to know and use these as protective barriers over their posters, prints, artwork etc.

Perhaps the number is very low? But as long as there is *some* UV protection in them, the manufacturer is safe in saying that it is a UV rated material. (And I'm not saying it is low, just thinking out loud here)

The bottom line tho: The producer/maker/developer of your overlays should be giving you this number (or a range, at least).

Anyplace else one may go to buy a piece of UV plexi, the salesman will know immediately what each different sheet is rated at (and that also is part of what determines the cost). Higher UV rating (a sheet's thickness) + larger sheet sizes = more expensive, in most cases. 

Jeff

[USMCSS]

Hi Robert,

The one comment I bolded above in your post is something that caught my eye and I don't quite understand. How and why would the scientist/manufacturer who produces your overlays NOT give you the exact UV protective rating number, if they are, in fact, true UV rated overlays? That information would be key (and basic) to anyone wanting (you as the seller) as well as any potential customer to know and use these as protective barriers over their posters, prints, artwork etc.

Perhaps the number is very low? But as long as there is *some* UV protection in them, the manufacturer is safe in saying that it is a UV rated material. (And I'm not saying it is low, just thinking out loud here)

The bottom line tho: The producer/maker/developer of your overlays should be giving you this number (or a range, at least).

Anyplace else one may go to buy a piece of UV plexi, the salesman will know immediately what each different sheet is rated at (and that also is part of what determines the cost). Higher UV rating (a sheet's thickness) + larger sheet sizes = more expensive, in most cases.  

Jeff

Hello Jeff, your question is very valid. I was getting different numbers from my supplier. So I ended up contacting the manufacturer not the supplier and spoke to a man who actually makes the overlays and has a title of Scientist. He could be called engineer, Doctor etc... for all I care but to me I felt like I was talking to the guy in the know. He stated that my overlays which are Frost do not have a UV Rating but are made with the same materials as their actual UV labeled overlays. Out of his mouth and my word as a man of integrity he stated that my overlays have uv protective properties. My overlays have a Non/Glare additive. I know the UV Overlays are thicker than mine and probably has a big factor in the protection.

With my experience with the overlays on my Jaws Poster and Boy Of The Streets Poster among others, I was Satisfied with that answer and feel good about selling them. This has been a long time ago and maybe there are numbers out there now. I will get back if I find them.

There are many people out there who have had my frames for many years. Some of them are on this forum. If you have had any noticeable fading please let it be known.

Fading is going to happen. No matter what. It is the degree of fading that matters and how fast it happens. If you want to know how much your posters fade from this point on then get a microscope and take a picture of an area on your poster and check it from time to time. That is the great thing about our frames, you can change your posters out from time to time to protect them from the light. The only way you can truly protect your poster is if you can't see it. The only way you can see a poster or anything for that matter is if light transmits off of it.

As I said before, I could label these overlays as having any amount of UV Protection I want, and most people would never know if it was true or not. I don't do that and never will!

Semper Fi!

[CSM]

Hello Chris, just saw your post after I made my last one. Just curious what makes you believe that American Frames overlays are UV Protective and that my overlays are suppositly UV Protective?  Because they wrote it in their description?

Hi Robert - let me say first of all I am not knocking your overlays in any way.  You were kind enough to help me with getting overlays cut to specific sizes and sent without frames.  You even threw in a few extra which I was certainly not expecting but have made great use of!  In fact, I find your overlays to be a great solution for replacing the crappy plastic overlays in department store bought frames.  

This is why I say if we could get some 'concrete proof' that there is actual UV protective properties in your overlays I would be more than willing to purchase more off you (and most likely Spotlight snap frames to go with them!).

As for Americanframe.com - when the thick plexi is shipped it comes with a protective paper sheet on the non-glare side that must be peeled off which reads "ACRYLITE® UV filtering (OP-3) - 98% UV filtering" or something very close to that.  It's definitely the OP-3 plexi as per this thread which Eric resurrected with additional info - http://www.allposterforum.com/index.php/topic,1955.msg128923.html#new

So it's not just lip service from Americanframe.com - what they claim on their website is supported by the product they ship.

Hope we can get some actual stats on the Vivak overlays you use...

[CSM]

UGH - of course I was referring to the thread Jeff posted in not this fictional 'Eric' character!  Baby brain + typing too fast syndrome strikes again.  Sorry Jeff!

[USMCSS]

Hi Robert - let me say first of all I am not knocking your overlays in any way.  You were kind enough to help me with getting overlays cut to specific sizes and sent without frames.  You even threw in a few extra which I was certainly not expecting but have made great use of!  In fact, I find your overlays to be a great solution for replacing the crappy plastic overlays in department store bought frames.  

This is why I say if we could get some 'concrete proof' that there is actual UV protective properties in your overlays I would be more than willing to purchase more off you (and most likely Spotlight snap frames to go with them!).

As for Americanframe.com - when the thick plexi is shipped it comes with a protective paper sheet on the non-glare side that must be peeled off which reads "ACRYLITE® UV filtering (OP-3) - 98% UV filtering" or something very close to that.  It's definitely the OP-3 plexi as per this thread which Eric resurrected with additional info - http://www.allposterforum.com/index.php/topic,1955.msg128923.html#new

So it's not just lip service from Americanframe.com - what they claim on their website is supported by the product they ship.

Hope we can get some actual stats on the Vivak overlays you use...

I appreciate it Chris.

As far as our overlays, I know they are not the be all end all. I just know that they are Safe for the posters and have provided proven light protection (As observed from the naked eye) for my posters for over 10 years. I am getting ready to put my Linen Backed American Graffiti in one today and it will be displayed for many years with indirect, direct, and house lighting. I am not one bit concerned.

I am getting the experiment ready and actually just purchased an 11" x 17" overlay from American Frames. I am using a unit called a Node to provide the Data. Great Product and Great Company!

http://variableinc.com/

I am waiting on some numbers as well for the overlays.

Have a good one Chris!

[CSM]

Looking forward to it Robert

[guest8]

I think we are over thinking this for sure. There are pics in eriks thread with other data that proves that actual UV damage is only a part of what causes fading and even with UV Glass the fading was the same as without! So the ONLY way to protect a poster is to not display it. But if you want to display it ..keep it out of direct light and rotate them out regularly!

[USMCSS]

  And I will be editing my last post above to reflect what you just said. I can't say Proven, because it is not true proof. It is Naked eye proof, and my eye. If I did a scan when I first put the posters in and then one now, there probably would be some type of change in color. But I will say it probably would be minimal. Direct Sunlight is the killer!

[CSM]

I think we are over thinking this for sure. There are pics in eriks thread with other data that proves that actual UV damage is only a part of what causes fading and even with UV Glass the fading was the same as without! So the ONLY way to protect a poster is to not display it. But if you want to display it ..keep it out of direct light and rotate them out regularly!

So would/are you comfortable framing your posters behind overlays/plexi/glass that has no UV filtering properties whatsoever? 

Another factor to consider I suppose (which is shown in Steve's original post) - is that "modern posters" - and yes it may just be in the way/with what inks certain ones are printed - don't seem to be affected nearly as much as "vintage posters" by light exposure...

[guest8]

So would/are you comfortable framing your posters behind overlays/plexi/glass that has no UV filtering properties whatsoever?  

Another factor to consider I suppose (which is shown in Steve's original post) - is that "modern posters" - and yes it may just be in the way/with what inks certain ones are printed - don't seem to be affected nearly as much as "vintage posters" by light exposure...

Yes, I am 100% comfortable using Robs overlays. I have considered swapping out all of my frames with his overlays, just because most of the ones I have from my early days are glossy and I'd prefer non-glare and his are a higher quality that what is already in there. I have plain glass is some of my smaller pieces that I really would like to change out but I always have something better to be doing. By smaller I mean 11x17 pieces that I just tossed into an off the shelf frame.

[CSM]

Yes, I am 100% comfortable using Robs overlays. I have considered swapping out all of my frames with his overlays, just because most of the ones I have from my early days are glossy and I'd prefer non-glare and his are a higher quality that what is already in there. I have plain glass is some of my smaller pieces that I really would like to change out but I always have something better to be doing. By smaller I mean 11x17 pieces that I just tossed into an off the shelf frame.

What about overlays that would come with a frame purchased from say Wal-Mart?

[guest8]

What about overlays that would come with a frame purchased from say Wal-Mart?

haha .. not Walmart .. but the overlays that come in them from Michael's are the ones that I am referring to swapping out with Robs. My viewing situation is a bit different than most though. Most of my posters are hanging in my theater which has all of the windows blacked out so there is no outside light and the only artificial light is from a single overhead light and the projector itself. So for the most part that room is one big flat file. They do not see any natural light what-so-ever.

The frames that I have in other rooms in the house are UV treated glass or plexi (only because I bought them framed). All my other frames have Robs overlays or overlays just like his.

[USMCSS]

Ok guys, I made an impromptu video to test some overlays.

I purchased a UV Sheet from a framing company someone mentioned on here. This will not be the only video and hopefully they will get better but it's a start,

You can see it here:

[Charlie]

Nice!

[erik1925]

Very nice video Robert. 

As far as experiments, I thought of one you might want to try (unless you thought of it already ).

Take 2 containers..Not very deep or big, maybe 1/2" deep and 5-6" in diameter. Inside these containers, put about 10 of those UV beads. Cover one with a piece of your overlay and the other with the piece you purchased.

Then set each of these in a room in your house, right next to each other, where you have other posters hanging. This way, it is the normal, everyday, indirect light your other posters are exposed to, vs direct sun, which even the best UV material wont protect against after time.

Let the beads sit and do their thing, and show how each set looks looks after a day or 2 (or longer if need be). (And have a third container, kept in total darkness, so you can use that set as the control). This would then be another clear way to see if both sets turned the same depth of color, of if one set remained lighter.

Jeff

[USMCSS]

Very nice video Robert. 

As far as experiments, I thought of one you might want to try (unless you thought of it already ).

Take 2 containers..Not very deep or big, maybe 1/2" deep and 5-6" in diameter. Inside these containers, put about 10 of those UV beads. Cover one with a piece of your overlay and the other with the piece you purchased.

Then set each of these in a room in your house, right next to each other, where you have other posters hanging. This way, it is the normal, everyday, indirect light your other posters are exposed to, vs direct sun, which even the best UV material wont protect against after time.

Let the beads sit and do their thing, and show how each set looks looks after a day or 2 (or longer if need be). (And have a third container, kept in total darkness, so you can use that set as the control). This would then be another clear way to see if both sets turned the same depth of color, of if one set remained lighter.

Jeff

Hey Jeff that is a great idea but I don't think that it would work. The beads don't have memory, they change color depending on the intensity of the light they receive at that moment. Once the light source is gone, the beads will be clear again.